Betrayer

How many do you think they'll have? Just looked at the Vegas line and it's 24.5, so my guess isn't far off from theirs either. Sure, they have more potential than last year with Cade on the team, but I struggle to name more than a handful of teams I'd expect them to beat. East: ORL, CLE, maybe TOR, maybe WAS West: HOU, OKC, maybe SAC, maybe MIN Even if they won every single one of those games, that's only 23 wins. You could throw in a couple more teams that they'll split the season series with (let's say SAS and CHA) and it would be exactly the Vegas line of 24.5 (we play CHA 3 times). In reality they'll lose some of those games and win some others they shouldn't, but the math should equal out. Outside of some unexpected talent growth explosion, this is not a 30 win team, and certainly not the 33+ it's going to take to get into the play-in tournament. I think 23-28 is the range, which is why I'm predicting 25. That's all ok though. I'm expecting a bad team as long as they're growing, developing talent, and I don't have to watch Joseph and Olynyk play the entire 4th quarter of every game like Casey is trying to save his job or something.

Rough game. Zero defense and when they tried they fouled instead. Pistons just looked outclassed in every way and Memphis looked more skilled and more athletic in every way. Shot making, rebounding, defense, finishing, you name it, Memphis did it better. Turnovers were out of control because they couldn't handle the defensive pressure. Killian - I really don't see anything here. Looked the same as always. Broken shot (2-9) and no real contribution elsewhere. Bey - Just couldn't get anything going, mostly because he couldn't get open against the Memphis D. Went out with an injury after the first half - didn't see anything other than one hard fall but he played plenty after that. Stewart - He was efficient, had some nice blocks, and grabbed a few boards so he played ok, but the team is going to struggle without an additional rebounder next to him (Grant doesn't rebound). He's not skilled enough to move to the 4 alongside another big, so this will continue to be an issue. Frank Jackson - Had a poor shooting night, as did most of the team, but he was one of the few bright spots in the second half with some aggression and some nice plays. Olynyk - 5 Turnovers and his shot was off. He couldn't find space to get open looks (nobody could) because Memphis was faster and more athletic. Joseph - Played well when he looked to get his own layups in an Ish Smith kind of way. Josh Jackson - One of the bright spots. Had an efficient game with very few turnovers. Diallo - Really had a subpar performance until garbage time in the 4th when he started to show more aggression and ball hog a bit. The rest of the game was pretty rough for him and he had 5 turnovers as well. I think his 3pt shooting last year was a bit of an anomaly. Shot doesn't look smooth at all and he's reluctant to shoot it. Probably a bit of a wake up call for those who think this team will be in the play-in tournament. Looking at the early schedule, I'm seeing probably 2 wins in their first 10 games and 4 or 5 in their first 20. Cade could change some things, but he's still a rookie and he's not a great athlete either, which was part of the problem last night (and will be on a nightly basis). I don't know if this is even a 25 win team. They certainly aren't going to win a lot of road games with this much youth. Good news is, that will mean another high lotto pick.

I'll agree that the Nets have the top spot in my most hated list - KD takes that spot by himself before we even get into the ball of crazy that is Kyrie and playstyle of Harden - but it's a close call for me when you put it up against the Lakers franchise and all the players like Melo, Howard, and Rondo that are hanging onto Lebron.

I've heard the tales of Killian in practice, but it's practice against Piston backups and Cade probably wasn't playing either because of the ankle. So, I'll have to wait until I see it on the court in an NBA game. Still though, what matters to me is his jumpshot and defense since I imagine that Cade and Grant will have the ball A LOT. I like what I've seen of him defensively so far in his young career, but not so much on the jumpshot. As for the court, I agree, the paint should be painted. I mean, it's in the name and everything.

I don't know which team I want to see fail more, the Lakers or the Nets. If they meet in the Finals it may be the first time in 20+ years I don't watch.

Disappointing that Cade isn't playing tonight, but I get it. Guess we'll have to wait another week or two to see the new guy in action. Wonder if he's been held out of practice these past couple weeks as well. Bad timing for a rookie.

Awesome, thanks for the explanation. Just glad to see that my community of online sports friends have found a new home where we can rant and rave about the Pistons (and other Detroit teams). Good to see some familiar faces popping up.

I'm excited for some NBA ball, as usual. Definitely want to watch the youngsters grow, but I agree that they will be pretty bad. It's easy to get excited, but when you look at the other teams in the league and thing objectively about it, 25-30 wins is about right. That's ok, Casey said as much during preseason. They're looking to grow with this core for one more year and then make some big noise in free agency next year to begin the real push. (side note: Is this the new forum for us MotownSports folks who've been on that forum for a decade? What happened to the other one? I'm old and confused, lol)