casimir
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Posts posted by casimir
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9 hours ago, chasfh said:
I'm not sure we have to find a catcher. We're not gonna win next year even with Realmuto, and we have what we hope is a potential All-Star in Jake who's coming back in 2023. We can't sign someone for more than a year, the market for catchers is for shit, so what are we doing, then?
If anything, you might pick up a non-tender or a cut in March. Otherwise, stick Haase and TBD out there for a year and hope for the best.
What a difference a year makes. Last year, Rogers was persona non grata among Tiger fans. Now his injury is considered by that same group (myself included) to be an impediment for next season.
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Quote
By Anthony Franco | October 19, 2021 at 10:26pm CDT
The Mets stumbled down the stretch, dropping out of the playoff race with a disappointing final couple of months. That wasn’t the fault of their marquee trade deadline acquisition, though, as Javier Báez lived up to expectations. Acquired from the Cubs on deadline day, Báez hit a fantastic .299/.371/.515 with nine homers in 186 plate appearances for the Mets.
Báez seemingly made a strong impression in his couple of months in the organization, and Andy Martino of SNY suggests there’s a legitimate possibility he and the club agree to a long-term deal relatively early into the offseason, although he cautions that the club has not yet put forth a formal extension offer. A return to the Mets would mean Báez moving permanently to second base, as Francisco Lindor already has shortstop accounted for in Flushing for the next decade.
This summer, Báez already showed some willingness to move off shortstop in deference to Lindor. While he started his Mets’ tenure at short while Lindor was recovering from an oblique issue, Báez slid over to the keystone for the season’s final five weeks. Assuming he’s willing to play second base regularly moving forward, he’d likely be a plus defender at the position who’s more than capable of sliding back over to shortstop if injuries and/or rest days necessitate.
An early-offseason strike of this magnitude by the Mets would be quite a surprise, since the club’s new president of baseball operations is yet to be determined. Signing a marquee free agent to a significant contract before or almost immediately after the hiring of the team’s new baseball operations leader would be an odd decision, but Martino writes that Báez has commanded the respect of owner Steve Cohen and team president Sandy Alderson.
Not only were Mets’ higher-ups impressed by Báez’s performance, according to Martino, they were also struck by his accountability for the now-infamous “thumbs down” saga. With the team reeling after the trade deadline, discontentment mounted and the Mets often faced plenty of criticism from their own fans. In response, some Mets players — Báez included — used a “thumbs down” celebration after certain plays to symbolically return the boos to their own fanbase. The behavior led to a stern rebuke from Alderson and a needless controversy, but Martino writes that Báez’s willingness to accept responsibility for the situation allowed the sides to put the matter behind them.
Celebration controversy aside, it’s easy to understand why Báez’s play apparently made such a strong impression on Cohen and Alderson. At his best, he’s a high-end defensive middle infielder and impact power threat, to say nothing of the obvious energy and flair he brings to an organization. In three of the past four seasons, Báez has posted above-average marks on both sides of the ball en route to campaigns valued at around four or five wins above replacement by both FanGraphs and Baseball Reference.
That impact potential makes Báez one of the key members of this offseason’s famously star-studded shortstop class. Still, he’s not in position to land the top-of-the-market deals of players like Carlos Correa or Corey Seager, as Báez has been prone to bouts of offensive inconsistency. His numbers in last year’s shortened season (.203/.238/.360 over 235 plate appearances) were awful. And while Báez finished this past season on a tear, he wasn’t great over the year’s first few months.
In 361 plate appearances with the Cubs prior to being traded, the 28-year-old (29 in December) hit .248/.292/.484. That’s roughly league average production, by measure of wRC+, with Báez’s impact power largely offset by a poor on-base percentage. In spite of his strong finish, it’s fair to question how reliably teams can count on Báez reaching base moving forward. He struck out in 33.6% of his plate appearances in 2021 while walking just 5.1% of the time, an essentially unparalleled combination for an above-average hitter. And over the past two seasons, no other hitter (minimum 500 plate appearances) has swung and missed at a higher percentage of pitches seen.
Báez’s somewhat enigmatic combination of elite power/glovework and perhaps the game’s most overaggressive approach makes him one of the most difficult players on the market to value. Martino suggests he could land a guarantee in the $150MM — $200MM range, although it’d frankly register as a surprise if any team were willing to commit that heavily to a player with such significant swing-and-miss concerns. Still, there’s little question that Báez will command a large contract of some kind this winter, whether from the Mets or another club.
The crosstown Yankees could certainly be a fit, as they’re generally expected to be involved in the bidding for some of the top free agent shortstops. Yankees general manager Brian Cashman flatly acknowledged this afternoon the club “(has) to address” the position in some manner this winter, with former shortstop Gleyber Torres now viewed as a second baseman. Martino reports the Yankees were “aggressive” in their pursuit of Báez via trade before he landed with the Mets this summer, and there’d certainly be some merit to considering another run at him in free agency over the coming weeks and months.
If Baez & the Mets potentially get an extension completed early, it seems like this would ramp up prices on the remaining SSs as Baez is off the board and one of the SSs moves to 2B. Not the best of news for Detroit.
On the other hand, I'd prefer the Tigers not sign Baez anyway. He'd be an upgrade over the flotsam & jetsam that the Tigers had at SS this past season, but I'm suspicious of the low OBP going forward.
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Chicago Bulls (0-0) vs Detroit Pistons (0-0)
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25 minutes ago, Tigeraholic1 said:
So you are also in favor of picture I.D. to vote?
Can we have both strong gun and strong voting controls in place?
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Schwarber in the regular season (2,579 PAs): .237/.343/.493.
Schwarber in the playoffs (115 PAs): .286/.391/.582.
Move over, Reggie?
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6 minutes ago, oblong said:
I don't watch Braves home games. I really dislike that team for some reason. Not just about The Chop.
This series is one I have no interest in. I went to bed 4-4 and just now bothered to check to see who won.
Grumpfart.
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There's plenty of room for improvement. Some of it will be internal. But there's certainly plenty of room to augment the roster externally.
Mize and Skubal in the rotation. Soto, Cisnero, Alexander, and Funkhouser in the bullpen. Fulmer somewhere on the pitching staff. Schoop at 2B, Candelario at 3B, Grossman in a corner, Baddoo in the OF. Haase behind the plate. These spots have been earned (some more than others).
Cabrera has the contract. Hill has the defensive chops if not the luck of health. Manning has the expectations. They're likely on the roster.
Torkelson and Greene are on the horizon if not the roster. Turnbull and Rogers are on the 60 IL.
Nothing else should be a scholarship to the active roster for Opening Day. Nothing else should be considered earned. All unmentioned 2021 Tigers come with the tag of "if". Plenty of room for improvement.
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3 hours ago, SoCalTiger said:
I love Marte and maybe his price does slip after shopping for shortstops but I think he will still be expensive and want 4 years. I look at Canha as much much cheaper and shorter term. Line 15/2 verses 70/4. Save $ for pitching. I keep thinking plug the defensive holes at short and catcher at reasonable cost , add a solid bat at low cost/short term assuming Greene and Tork to come up and contribute slower and save big money for pitching . Lots of it.
I would prioritize SP, SS, SP, C, and RP, and more P before CF. And the RP is a tough one to gauge because of the volatility in that realm. I don't trust it going forward, someone else mentioned the peripherals, and I agree. Maybe that's where Fetter gets more out of RP than peripherals suggest, I don't know.
But if the market gets goofy for SS and ignores Marte, he can help the Tigers offensively and defensively.
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3 hours ago, 1984Echoes said:
In two years that could be fine.
Candy would leave after 2023 as a FA... And Kreidler/ Workman would take over as SS.
If anyone is on board with that.
The benefit to signing a SS is that there is plenty of room on the defensive spectrum to slide down and still be productive. If one wants to assume Kreidler/Workman will be major league SSs in a few seasons, .... I'm not too sure that's a risk I'm comfortable assuming, I want to see more out of both. But, yes, Correa (or Seager/Story/Semien) could move off of SS if the Tigers have access to a major league ready SS when Candelario hits free agency.
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2 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:
Correa would be 37 at the end of a 10yr deal. Assume you are willing to write off/buy out one year, call it 36. How many SS are still useful at 36 and does Correa fit the profile of those that are?
Jeter was pretty close to 'generational' and his string of OPS+ >100 years ended at 35, with a decent comeback yr at 38. About the same for Ripken. Do folks think Correa lives in that company?
This is why I think he could have an opt out if he signs for 10 or fewer years. I think he will set himself up to be a free agent at 30 or 31 and try to get a deal through his age 39/40 season.
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49 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:
would not disagree. And I won't complain one bit if the Tigers are the one's to pay it, though I'm not in the camp that thinks you have to have superstar players to be the best team so I won't be mad if they don't pay that either.
I will.
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33 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:
Jorge Soler is another potential right handed power bat we could go after. Is bad defensively and can only play the corners but he can hit for a ton of power.
I prefer no longer going after DH only types. I would really like the Tigers to use the DH as a semi off day for the everyday players.
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4 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:
I thought I read the Astros have already made him an offer in the 5/125 range and that is so far short of his assumed value the conclusion is that there is not much chance of them retaining him. Which should be a cautionary note for other teams. When one of the most successful franchises in recent years is making a value judgment that is something like 100% different than the talking heads, you might stop to ask why.
Here is one report that google tossed up where Correa is quoted saying the Astros were 'not even close"
We can spitball here and easily assume north of $35M per and longer than 7 with a player opt out after a few seasons, right?
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16 minutes ago, mtutiger said:
Part of the struggle I see with Correa as well is that the Astros themselves may want to up their ante with him too.
They will have to pay a ransom to get him, and honestly as much as I'd love to see him in a Tiger uniform, not at too steep a price.
In terms of where he'd rather play, this is probably an overrated factor, but one selling point of coming to a Detroit would be that he would be THE guy here, not just another cog in murderers row with the Yankees.
I dont know if that matters for a lot of players tho. Probably not.
Is it just me, or does this seem to be lost in speculation about where he goes to?
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15 hours ago, sabretooth said:
If they get a quality hitter, I don't think they are going to have any problem finding spaces to put guys. Its not like Miggy will require 162 games at DH and 1B. And Schoop has 2B wide open. And none of the OF in their system right now require full-time play in the place of a good hitter.
I am not sure that Canha is the player I want....his power/age is in question, and his glove along with Grossman's arm would weaken OF defense a little too much for my taste. If he had 25+ HRs in him and a .450 SLG/.200 ISO, maybe.
Duvall, Pederson are a couple of guys who I think could be signed for Cron/Schoop money and who could add the offense that they need with a decent glove.
I guess I hadn't realized Canha is going to be 33 soon. I guess now rethinking it, I wouldn't go more than 2 years on him. Looking at his numbers again, there might be some evidence of the downside of his career, although the abbreviated 2020 is tough to judge.
Pederson would make for a really lefty heavy OF. I'm not sure that's ideal. Grossman can play everyday. But then Pederson and at least one of Greene/Baddoo would likely make the Opening Day roster. I suppose if one of the kids is ticketed for Toledo or used as trade bait, Pederson makes sense. I don't know, it seems like a RHB OF makes more sense for a decent balance in the OF. And, yes, this assumes RHBs in Cabrera, Schoop, a C, Torkelson in the lineup.
I guess Greene is assumed to be an everyday player. Baddoo showed some capability to go the other way against LHPs, although the consistency certainly isn't there (not surprising, he's a young kid, a rule 5 kid, and he's lost a good amount of development time not just due to COVID).
Starling Marte just turned 33, so he kind of goes against what I said about age and decline with Canha. But he's also better than Canha, so there's that. Does an OF of Baddoo/Greene/Marte/Grossman sound like fun? Maybe Marte is the bargain due to age and the SS bacchanal?
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15 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:
Duvall isn't alone in this, scouring the box scores throughout the league I noticed quite a few guys playing center that I wouldn't have expected.
My hypothesis to this is that teams are realizing that teams are realizing with more HRs and less gappers its not as important to have a good defender out there. Either the ball is hit over the fence, its hit so hard only the elite can get to it or it's popped up. That and with the advanced batted ball data you can position guys where they don't have to cover as much ground.
That's an interesting theory, I hadn't thought of that. Although I do remember half heartedly suggesting an OF of Granderson and Maybin on the corners with Ordonez in CF with the point being Granderson and Maybin could cover from the lines through the gaps and Ordonez wouldn't have much of a slice of defensive responsibility.
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9 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:
pretty bush league move at the plate after he hit it though. Do all the posing you like, but do it after you run the bases.
He had to take off his arm armor before strolling the bases, otherwise he might'of injured himself.
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9 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:
I personally want a power guy like an Adam Duvall, he played some center this year for the Braves so he's versatile enough to handle all 3 spots.
Yeah his obp sucks but you can basically pencil him in for 30 bombs if he plays regularly and I think that's what the Tigers need most, particularly since I expect them to lose Hasse's 25 due to him coming back to Earth.
What’s crazy about Duvall is that his first MLB experience in CF was at the age of 31 even though he’s had MLB OF time since he was 26.
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I like the FA suggestions of Canha. He gets on base and has some power, and he sounds versatile enough that, if he can be used in CF on occasion, he should be fine in a corner for Detroit. Plus, if he can pick it at 1B, maybe that also helps the bench a bit without sacrificing too much offense if Torkelson can move across the diamond to give a day off to Candelario once in a while.
I like Grossman to repeat. I know some are suspicious of his career highs, but I think a lot of his ratios line up to when he was a platoon player (which doesn’t always work out that way).
The problem with going after an OF is that the Tigers probably have room for only 4 unless they get the pitching staff down to 12. I’m still not acclimated to 13 pitchers, but that’s the way MLB works these days. So, Grossman and Canha, then two of Baddoo / Greene / Hill? Maybe Greene starts out in AAA to work on CF and maybe cutting down on Ks? It seems unlikely to go with 2 lefty bats in that instance, considering those 2 slots would need to play CF (not sure Canha would be up to CF in Detroit’s OF)
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1 hour ago, Edman85 said:
Question for those of you throwing out Goodrum, Harold, Willi, or Carlton out there as trade bait...
There is something that happens in mid February that opens up the free agency floodgates. Do you know what it is? My hint: look at transaction logs around that time the last few years.
Once you see what that is, you will see why those guys likely have next to no if not negative trade value right now
Groundhog Day? If they see their shadow, they have to be kept on the 40 for six more weeks?
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28 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:
The caution is that the bird in hand rule always applies - you never end up having nearly as many good options as you think you had when you let any >2 WAR player walk because you think it will be easy to do better. It just never is.
I want all of the birds. And then if and when there are too many birds, the Tigers can trade some of the birds for some reptiles and mammals to address other needs on the team.
Edit to add: I ain't counting on all of the birds being able to fly.
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I have a hard time with the Dodgers-Giants game not starting until 9pm ME time. But on the other hand, its 6pm for the local fanbases and they deserve a starting time that benefits themselves.
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1 minute ago, gehringer_2 said:
and Trout following in Cabrera's footsteps not only in being a generational talent but also in getting paid big dollars to be injured.....
Which is a another reason that spreading your funds across many good players can work out better than putting huge dollars into one or two superstars.
Opportunity cost and resource allocation.
MotownSports Forums Down Again
in General Discussion
Posted
Great song.
This past weekend, there was a high school band rendition of it at halftime of the football game. The effort was nice, but the slower pace made it suffer in comparison to the original.
The other school did a halftime show homage to previous cult classics, like the SpongeBob theme (a little slow, but good), the Simpsons (good stuff), and Star Trek (sounded really good by a marching band).