KL2

Just now, TP_Fan said:

Goff is the worst starter in the league.  There is no one worse. 

But he has the same stats as Stafford!

Just now, buddha said:

i dont have to go back that far.

dont get mad at me because iowa lost today...

I'm not mad cause Iowa lost. And you didn't have to go back that far, yet one guy you listed in your response was from 2010. Which has little to do with Michigan football today. It was what two or three head coaches a go. My guess is that a lot changes in terms of development between different coaches. 

Or maybe you could site Charles Woodson I mean he played at Michigan too 

The point was under harbaugh they've all been busts. All of em. Doesn't that make you at least say hmmmm is there something going on or is it just a massive coincidence. If I was a GM I'd go wait a sec, these highly rated, highly drafted players all busted out. What's the common demoninator? 

On 10/5/2021 at 9:44 PM, RandyMarsh said:

Other than to take a shot at Michigan what was the point of making the post to begin with if you concede that none of the players were seen as high as Hutchinson? 

That I would question Hutchinson in the fact that other very high rated players from the same school didn't pan out. Sure none of them went 1-2-3. But we're not talking 242. WE're talking 10-11-12. 

If I was a NFL GM I would question what is going on in the Michigan program and whether what they teach/train translates to the NFL. 

On 10/5/2021 at 9:42 PM, buddha said:

the fact that you think brandon graham hasnt been a success lets me know you have no clue what youre talking about.

The fact you have to go back to 2010, when RIch Rod was the head coach shows you totally missed the point

11 hours ago, Cruzer1 said:

They are mostly built through the draft, and get extra picks every year.

Of their starting 9 and 11 man pitching staff, a total of 3 guys were drafted by the rays. (keimeir, lowe, Shane M...if you added in international signings it jumpts to 4)

So 4/20 20 percent. I don't think that's "mostly"

11 hours ago, Cruzer1 said:

Basically, I would love for the Tigers to follow their model, they really know how to build on their talent base. They are mostly built through the draft, and get extra picks every year.

They've also won exactly as much as we have since 2000

55 minutes ago, sabretooth said:

I also don't want to see this team rewarded for tanking by sneaking into the playoffs at 84 wins simply based on the contributions of tanking picks like Mize, Tork, and Greene.  I will root for these guys, but I don't want to see the Tigers get to the playoffs without building a legit good team.

I'll root for the guys we got by tnaking but I don't like that they helped a non-tanking team make the playoffs and they aren't a good team. 

Man kinda all over the place here aren't you?

7 hours ago, SoCalTiger said:

They could trade for Paul DeJong of the Cardinals. Poor hitter but great glove and was 1.6 war last year. Then load up on pitching. After all the expensive free agents shortstops get signed then circle back and try to trade for good minor league shortstop thats blocked even if they are two years away. 

Good rookie year, fairly useless all other and I gotta give up something to get him. Pass

22 hours ago, Stanley70 said:

Some would argue that you shouldn't invest big in free agency if you are not going to field an expected playoff team.

 

 

 

Ok but that's not what you wrote

30 minutes ago, Stanley70 said:

Unless the Tigers spend a lot of money on 3-4 free agents, they are going to open the season with some serious holes on the team. And that is with Tork and Green making the team. I don't know if they will spend or begin trading prospects to fill SS, 2 SP's, C and some bullpen help. We are counting on Manning to fill a spot in the rotation and that is no certainty either.

I am sure they will spend some and then hope to find lower priced players to fill out the rest of them team, but it seems like a long shot to fill all of the holes enough to build an expected playoff team. 

In 2023 the picture looks a lot better with MIggy coming off the books, Turnbull coming back, and the most recent draft class being closer to the bigs.

Not sure what you're expecting. 

Top flight short stop $30 million. 

One of the pitching spots will go to alexander/injury guys/pena/wentz/et all. So $10 million for a pitcher. 

Then $5 million for a catcher (Hesse will be one and the other guy will just be a stop gap). Even if I spend $5 million for a bullpen arm or two (most the bullpen will be back). That's filling all the needs you mention for $50 million a year.

And I doubt they think they are playoff team next year even with the additions. Given the youth of the team. .500 is a more reasonable goal.

4 hours ago, Jim Cowan said:

I like Semien, and you might be right about him wanting to play short again.  I'm really not sold on Correa, he has only stayed healthy for two full seasons and he's part of the crew that exposed Hinch's leadership weakness in Houston.

 

I like it. Not sold on Correa for health reason. But you are sold on the 30 year year old who wasn't much until his 28 year old season. 

On 10/4/2021 at 8:54 PM, SoCalTiger said:

Better yet would be if the new CBA might allow trading draft picks ?

Probably not

A version of the spring training blue tops wouldn't be the worst thing. So long as its used about 10 games 

32 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said:

I personally think he'll come back as well...

But I would just be uncomfortable with a multi-year deal at this point.

Not certain if I'm thinking organizationally (thinking that way definitely says no to me) or if personally I'm in that "prove it to me" mode... probably a little bit of both...

You're making it seem like its gonna sign a 8 year deal

6 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:

How many Michigan guys have really been picked in the top half of the first or were rated as highly as Hutchinson is projected to be?

Brandon Graham was I believe 10th overall and he's had a solid career.

Devin Bush was off to a great start being on the All Rookie Team before tearing his ACL.

Jabrill Peppers hasn't been great but he's been much better since going to the Giants and is still starting and contributing 5 years after being drafted. Perhaps a little disappointing but for a late 1st not the end of the world. 

Rashan Gary is the lone early pick disappointment that comes to mind and quite frankly he's been a disappointment since he got out of High School so perhaps the finger should be pointed to him. 

Am I missing anybody cause I'm just going off the top of my head, if not I think there have been too few of elite picks that busted to put anything into it.

If this post serious are just through michigan eyes?

No nobody was high as hutchinson (and if you noted i admit he might be fine, who knows). But, Michigan's track record on defensive picks is god awful. 

I went back and did the counting. 13 defensive players picked in the first three rounds, 6 first rounds. 1 pro bowler in Frank Clark. If you count peppers, two starters. That's terrible and to try to justify Graham, Bush, peppers or gary as examples of some type of success is just silly. None of them have had any type of success. They are like the Will Harris' of their teams. 

It's like if me an a Iowa fan uses Spivey as a success story. Well he started some games...

1 minute ago, 1776 said:

My impression from his comments is that he is going to spend judiciously. This may, and could, result in a big contract for a player. But there isn’t a promise out there that there is going to be a headliner signing. 

Well you're never gonna promise cause that would hurt bargining and you never know what the market with show. 

I just wanted to dispell that line I quote, from all indications spending is what they want to do. 

12 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:

I know Michigan hasn't really played any good offenses but to my untrained eye he just pops off the screen, like every play it seems like he either is the one making the play or the one that caused the disruption that lead to the other guy making the play. 

At some point NFL will catch on a bit, but when was the last time a Michigan defender was good in the NFL? Not saying Hutchinson can't be, but its certaintly a worrisome trend. Michigan keep putting out high defensive picks, and they amount to zippo. Is it scheme, training, physical that doesn't translate?

50 minutes ago, 1776 said:

Al Avila isn’t going to dump a bundle on anyone. 

except they prtty much said they will....

51 minutes ago, lordstanley said:

Will any of Mize, Skubal or Manning be on a season inning limit again next year?

Probably depends on record, how they feel and what not. They did 150 this year, so if they are chugging around .500 then they might cap it around 175. If they are in the hunt they might let Mize go a bit more

I imagine it will be something like Top Tier SS (think Story) and then Maybe Verlander if he wants. If not think Grinke. Then a reliever like Mychael Givens. 

The problem wiht OP is if we sign some shortstop to 200Plus. Then sign a tier one FA then sign the top reliever. Well I can't think of any team that has swept the FA market like that. Not to mention the cost of signign Chaffin, Igelsias, SS and Tier one pitcher is gonna approach $500 mililon

Fun fact. We finished two games behind the Padres

BuT GoFF HaS SimILaR STaTS To STaFFOrD

13 minutes ago, buddha said:

you know tp is just schtick, right?  its his thing.

the lions had the worst secondary in football coming into the season and then lost two of their top three corners.  undrafted journeyman bobby price is trying to cover robinson and mooney!  

wasn't just him. 

2 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

I don't think anyone said that. 

Literally they did. Tp for one. And you were one that kept saying how they were gonna be better.

"they have more talent this year than last" 

--Several posters