Betrayer

Below average shooter, below average defender, too many turnovers. He'd fit right in, but no thanks.

Nah, I'll pass on that. December 15th is right around the corner, and every game is pushing me more and more towards the "trade him now" side of the fence as he trends downward from his hot start. Last night's game against Boston was a shinning example of this. I want a bigger 3 and D player at the other guard spot. Not someone who's going to be a small'ish average defender (at best), an inconsistent 3 point shooter, and a guy who turns it over too much for his role. He'll be a fine 6th man candidate someday for a team who already has their stars in place, but paying him to be the #2 player in this core isn't it. I was pretty excited on draft day, but this past offseason I said that they needed to trade at least one these 2022 guys before they become extension eligible. If anything, the clarity that we now have about these guys after seeing them on a semi-competent team has only served to solidify that viewpoint for me.

I mean that in the short term the Pistons are better when Beasley is on the court and in the long term I'd like to see a longer, more switchable lineup to take advantage of Cade's size...so where does that leave Ivey? Do you extend him for big money this offseason and lock in this duo as your 1A and 1B players going forward? As much as I like Ivey, I'm not sure I see that future working out. You also have to consider the fact that you probably can't afford to extend all of these high draft picks for the next three years. At some point you have to consolidate and waiting too long often means being stuck with a bad signing (Drummond), having to sell low (Duren), or just cutting the player when the value bottoms out (Killian). The other option is to use his success this season to package him in a trade to bring in that 1B star, move up in the draft to get that player, or acquire future picks that could be packaged for a 1B star later on. I'm not saying give up or sell low on Ivey, I'm just saying if I was GM I would have my eyes open for the right deal if it came along.

He's 35, so contenders only I'd assume.

This was a best case scenario. Now you can get far more for him in a trade than you would have after the Monty season. Sadly, the opposite happened with Duren and his value has diminished. I'm a fan of Ivey, but as of right now I'd start Beasley over him. And if I'm thinking about the future, then I want to reap the benefits of a 6'6" PG by having a long, switchable starting 5. Maybe you can run Ivey as your bench scorer in that scenario, but he's clearly not a PG and I don't want to give him a Jalen Green level extension this offseason for a Malik Monk role. Depends upon what trades are out there because I'm certainly not giving him away, but I'm not asking for an Ainge return either because I'm still not sure I like the composition of this core for getting into the top half of the East in the next couple years.

Interesting. That Reed contract could be a nice toss for a team that just wants to cut him after the trade, provided Detroit is getting a Center back in the deal.

Brandon Ingram is hurt? Wow. Never thought that would happen. /s Insane that some Piston's fans want to throw assets at this guy and then have to double down with a 50M/yr extension.

Are Reed and Moore guaranteed contracts?

Ivey had a really rough stretch in there before JB was forced to bring Cade back in to stop the bleeding. They just don't have anyone they can run the offense through when Cade's out. There's no 1B star. All of these vets are role players and Ivey is really hit or miss with the ball in his hands. Question is, do you play it out and hope for lottery luck to get that 1B player or do you consolidate some assets to trade for him? They'll probably make that decision in the next two months depending upon the standings.

Repeating a Drummond situation is my concern as well. I don't want to invest a lot of money in a Center that can't shoot or defend just because we waited too long to make a decision. It was a bad idea back then and it's an even worse idea in today's NBA.

So, you're saying there's a chance we could win on January 1st?

A lot of talk about starting lineup changes after JB's "starters need to be ready to start" comments from last game. I agree about the Ivey/Beasley switch. Here's the starting lineup I'd roll with: Cade Beasley Thompson Harris Stew Get your two best defenders in the starting lineup. Spacing is about the same as before, maybe better if Thompson's small sample size 33% is to be believed and if Stew gets back to taking a few more. Let Ausar be the DHO hub in the same way you used Duren and get him into that Draymond role. He's a better passer than Duren, has a higher IQ, and can actually attack out of that spot far more easily to keep defenses honest. That said, the org has to decide who they want to trade between Stew and Duren and start that person. The other is your bench Center when you bring in a legitimate starter, so you're not worried about hurting their value by benching them and you might as well get them accustomed to their forever role.

The NBA is such a one trick pony now. Chuck threes all game. If you're lucky you have a star who can play the boring foul game. Moving screens all day and defenders have no right to their space. Having just one way to win is boring. Rant aside, you can't win if you can't rotate on defense and contest shooters. It also doesn't help if you give the ball away so they have extra possessions. It's a simple as that. It's also becoming increasingly obvious that this team has 2 backups Centers and no starter. Choose your backup between Duren and Stew, and trade the other. I'm still listening to offers for Ivey as well. I was in favor of trading one or both of them during the offseason and that hasn't changed for me. In a bubble either of them are fine in the right role, but I'm not paying them big money this offseason to lock them up as my "core".

Agreed. He did have foot surgery, which I imagine has to impact your offseason routine since you probably can't walk or run for a long time. Still though, he just looks like kind of lost, like he's trying to figure out his role. For some reason he's hesitating on open threes and dribbling too much.

Exactly. Most NBA players who aren't on the Pistons are going to make wide open threes. It's a practice shot. I understand that Giannis is a problem with his ability to run directly through you and still get the call, but you at least have to guard the shooters. I saw so many missed rotations and defensive breakdowns, it would be impossible to count them all. This team put all their resources into offense over the summer and, other than Beasley, it hasn't gone well. They're a bottom third team on offense (bad shooting and turnovers). They've been top third on defense, but we really starting to see that come back to earth, no matter how much JB has them playing above their talent level on that end most nights. It's going to be a long December with Boston, New York, Boston, and Miami as the next 4 games. Then you've still got Utah, Phoenix, LA, Sac, Denver, and then Orlando on Jan 1. I could see this team going 2-8 during that stretch with a win over the Jazz at home and maybe stealing that Heat game. Hard to project too many more winnable games this month.

I was thinking the same thing, but then I get PTSD about the two big man lineup. However, if you take Duren out for Stew then who guards Lopez? You can put Harris on him, but Lopez is going to run to the post every play. I suppose you can live with that over the threes he'll get with Duren guarding him, but securing the defensive rebound with Harris and Stew is going to be a real problem against Lopez and Giannis. Maybe if you also put in Ausar over THJ you can make up for some of the rebounding and also have a better option to guard Dame. Bottom line, it's a bad matchup. You have to give Giannis the jumper and hope he doesn't turn into prime KD again like he did last game.

True. They already have 136M guaranteed, which is just crazy. Things look like they open up the year after, but that's when Ivey and Duren's extensions would kick in (if that happens).

He's been pretty bad since he hit his head. Maybe someone needs to hit him in the head again to reset him. After the game, JB put this one on the schedule since they didn't get home from Indy until 5am the night before. I still think they should've shown more fight against a 3 win team, but if rest is the excuse then I want to see them come out swinging against the Bucks on Tuesday.

Can they offer him an extension during the season? Not sure if he'd take it because he's playing himself into a much bigger contract, but just wondering.

The problem is you'd need to give up picks to get people to take those contracts, which is the opposite of what you want to do if you're going to rebuild. They've really screwed themselves by waiting too long to blow this thing up with players that were losing value the entire time.

Not a fan of the point differential tie-breaker. I'd rather see a points system like they do in Summer League where you get points for each quarter you win, or something like that. It feels like NBA2K out there with starters trying to run up the score in a 20 blow point blowout. Either way, that was a heck of a game by the Pistons on both ends. Outside of a turnover stretch to start the 4th, they really cooked the Pacers. Outside, inside, defensively. That was the whole package, especially the effort.

Every team in the league runs 3 or 4 guys who can shoot in their starting lineup. That's called NBA basketball and nobody is saying you shouldn't do that. That leaves you room for 1 or 2 guys who are questionable shooters and Ausar is one I'm putting in the game without question. I'm prioritizing his minutes over Holland's as well. Give me an All-NBA defender with top 5% athleticism, steals, blocks, great rebounding, good passing and bball IQ. And that's from someone who wanted Cam Whitmore over Ausar in the draft. Just don't be a dumb coach and stick him one pass away in the strong side corner (yet) like Monty did or like JB has done with Holland. It's literally the dumbest place to put a guy who can't shoot. Better yet, on offense he can be in the pick and roll as either the handler or screener. He can be the DHO hub like how they're using Duren (or how Draymond is often used). He can also operate out of the dunker spot as you called out. It works even better with Stew in the lineup since you can invert them. Now, not only do you have better spacing but you also have a better defensive Center in there to go along with Ausar's elite defense.

One of Ausar's 4 three point attempts was a 3/4 quart heave to end the quarter. So, he's actually shooting 33% in the 2 games he's played. He probably won't shoot that on the year, but if he does I'll certainly take it from a potential All NBA defender.

Pistons really squandered a weak November schedule that could have seen them get to .500 or better. Get ready for some rough times ahead with the next 5 games being: Pacers Sixers Bucks Celtics Knicks After that you get Utah, which is winnable, but then a west coast trip against the Suns, Lakers, Kings, and Nuggets before coming home to face the Magic on Jan 1. Ouch.

Well, that was painful.