gehringer_2

1 hour ago, chasfh said:

So maybe the way they handle this is, first round is best of three, but the division winner starts the series up 1-0, so they have to win only one on the field,

I'd guess there would be a lot of resistance to doing a handicapped series, but in reality it makes a lot of sense. The conventional reward for the top teams in any playoff would be a bye, but in baseball extended time off is about the worst thing that you can do to team. Thus the handicapped series makes a lot more sense, but I still doubt that would change minds among the great unwashed, who will see it as strange and 'unfair.'

3 hours ago, casimir said:

Dislike.

Oh, this is good.  Sent me the wikipedia to read about him.

IIRC, Burns played God in a film with John Denver in the 70's

here it is:

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0076489/

and here are george and his partner gracie. Gracie Allen was very funny. I used to hear their routines when I was a kid and I never got the jokes. I didn't realize how talented she was until I was  older and they were long gone.

https://youtu.be/yDCjhLOaNZI

2 hours ago, RatkoVarda said:

The arbitration salary becomes guaranteed if the player is on the 25-man roster when the season begins.

good stuff. I did not know the guarantee didn't kick in until the 1st day of season.  Is the prorating is based on 187 days? If so then 45 days would be about 1/4 of the contract? I imagine most teams don't even want to go there for a player they get nothing back from.

19 minutes ago, SoCalTiger said:

I don't think you can plan on Boyd to pitch in 2022

IDK - this procedure is supposed to have a significantly shorter rehab than TJ.  But sure that is the obvious question. Whether or not they might have some clarity around his return schedule before arbitration decisions have to be made will obviously play into the decision in a big way.

1 hour ago, RandyMarsh said:

Now I'm just hoping they don't become the first team to finish 0-17.

0-16 and 0-17 would be the matching bookends for Stafford's Lion career.

8 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said:

But if a team and player go to arbitration and the player wins, does that mean the team has to pay him what the arbitrator decides? I mean, can a team just refuse and release the player?

I don't think you can do that. If the team goes to arbitration they are obligated to pay whichever award is made - in effect it would become like any other MLB contract - guaranteed. If you don't want to risk paying the award you have to give the player his release before arbitration - he's then a free agent.

6 minutes ago, Useful Idiot said:

Perhaps you could share a little understanding on the following:  Who is going to be paying for Boyd's surgery?  O always had the uninformed opinion that the ball clubs pay for this sort of thing. If they intend to non-tender him, then they can't be too wild about paying for a surgery that does not present a tangible benefit to them?

I'm sure that Boyd could easily afford it out of his own pocket, but that's not the way I've always thought it worked.

Perhaps there is some "double platinum" version of workman's comp that also includes elective surgeries? 

Good question, I've wondered about that one too. That's the kind of question that Shelton used to know the answer to.

Ugly turnover by a D-guy I've heard of (and probably won't again) to put the Wings down 5-4

33 minutes ago, Useful Idiot said:

Thank you,  I really failed to appreciate (or care, for that matter) of a possible distinction. But now that you have primed the pump...in the baseball arbitration process, the arbitrator is not free to devise his own  compromise solution, he can side with either the organization, or with the player...he must pick from the best and final offers placed on the table....so...doesn't that clear the hurdles of what you describe as an arbiter?

true, his choice is constrained in that sense, but it's still his free choice to make. Maybe a counter example would be the Senate Parliamentarian. He/she is the arbiter of a set of rules. They make rulings but only to apply that set of rules, it's not (supposed to be!) his/her political preference that says whether something can be included in a reconciliation bill, they're there to apply a rule without regard to which they think is the better outcome. There is no rule determining which offer the baseball arbitrator chooses. He can pick either precisely because he thinks it is the fairer outcome. He is supposed to apply his own judgment. Anyway - that is how I now understand it.

51 minutes ago, casimir said:

I wonder if he sounds like Morgan Freeman or Paul Carey?

George Burns

1 hour ago, Useful Idiot said:

Correct term is "final" offer. Both sides submit what they are willing to accept, and the arbiter picks from either/or

LOL. So I was going to use 'arbiter' in my prior posts but realized I didn't know if there was a difference between 'arbiter' and 'arbitrator' or if 'arbitrator' was just another needless addition of syllables to sound more imperious.

Turns out there is one. In law, an arbiter executes a ruling he doesn't have any choice in - IOW he can only apply some pre-existing rule - his function is what I believe they call 'ministerial'. In contrast an 'arbitrator' has freedom to create an outcome. So since in baseball the choice between the contracts is one the guy in question is free to make using his own judgement, he is an 'arbitrator'. So I learned something new today.

2 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said:

Right... but I thought there was some kind of similar process... Like not extending an (arbitration) offer makes that player a free agent. Call it qualifying or whatever the correct terminology is...

right - if the team refuses to go to arbitration the player becomes a FA.

16 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said:

I have no interest in Boyd in 2023.

Don't you have to extend a QO? To get arbitration?

Don't extend a QO. He's not going to sign anywhere else anyways. Sign him to a minor league contract so he can rehab in our system, which is me being nice here, and see if he's able to pitch in July/ August with the Tigers. He can also have a stipulation in the contract that he's in MLB with the Tigers by mid-July, or he gets released and is a FA. If he's not ready for MLB, he's a FA at the end of 2022 one way or another, so let him go.

I'm not interested in offering him any more than that.

More or less, but I think QO terminology is usually used for offers made to free agents.  If a team doesn't make a QO they are not eligible for draft compensation for losing a player in FA.  In arbitration both sides make a proposal, the arbitrator picks one. I guess you could call that a QO but it's not the usual use of term I think. In practice it is similar since a team can always renounce a player and refuse to go arbitration at all - which in effect is making no arbitration offer. But with a FA the exact size of the QO is fixed by formula. That isn't the case for arbitration offers.

10 minutes ago, casimir said:

My guess is it is probably in Boyd’s best interest to rehab with an organization that he is comfortable with.  Maybe it makes sense to agree on a one year contract with a one year vesting/mutual option?

And it's more than just comfort. Players don't own the metrics data the teams have on them. So if you are rehabbing and you want to see your mechanics video/motion capture data etc, and you are with a new team you are SOL unless you have your own from an independent biomechanics lab or training facility like Driveline. Your old team is not likely going to give that stuff to your new team.

3 hours ago, slothfacekilla said:

No Bertuzzi tonight, not sure if it is injury management or other reasoning.

quothe Blashill "But he's in a spot where we're progressing him and we'll see."

There's American English and Canadian English and even Canadien French - and then there is NHLese.   

8 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said:

2022 is Boyd's 4th and final year of arbitration. he made 6.5M in 2021, so if they offer him arbitration, he gets at least 5.2M (80%). seems like a lot for a guy who might get 10 starts in. 5M probably gets you a decent 5th starter w/o injury concerns.

they are going to need to work something out before the arbitration deadline. like 2022 at $3m, with team option at $10M for 2023, or a $2M buyout. Boyd gets $5m minimum.

Drew Smyly and Michael Pineda both signed 2/10M contracts coming off TJ, with expectation that they would not ptich year 1

 

so last year the arbitration deadline date was Jan 15. Will Boyd and the Tigers even know by that date when he would be ready? Reports at the time of the surgery were "6-9" months but that 3 month uncertainty is half the season counting from the end of this Sept.

27 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said:

I don't think the Tigers will sign Boyd. Isn't he eligible for arbitration? What would he cost us? Don't get me wrong, I want him as long as he's healthy. But at what price do you draw the line?

The Tigers have been largely successful avoiding arbitration awards and I don't follow other teams' arbitration issues so I have no idea what an arbitrator does with a guy who is hurt. As far as I understand the system, in general they tend to reward seniority - in which case an arbitrator might be likely to make an award larger than the Tigers would be willing to accept, so they would have incentive to cut him loose. OTOH, if Boyd realizes he is damaged goods and the Tigers are going to cut him loose rather than go to arbitration, and he knows no other team is going to offer him much as FA, and he wants to stay, he might just come to an agreement with the Tigers and waive arbitration.

46 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

I have absolutely zero expectations for Hasse going forward,  he was a great 2 month story where he regularly destroy mistake pitches but once he started getting fewer and fewer of those abs his HR/fb ratio started to normalize his true colors came out and they arent good. 

That's one of the reasons that Im pining for another power bat cause I know his 20 some HRs he hit this year is likely not going to repeat itself so we're gonna have to find a way to make up for that loss of production next season. 

Yup - Haase's long term OPS isn't going to be any better than Greiner's, but you'll get a few more HR and he runs better. If they get really, really lucky with Dingler, he might rate a call-up sometime mid-season, but that would be pure luck - he's as like not to hit a wall somewhere on the way up. Bottom line I don't see any alternative to but find a catcher by trade or FA, and they will have to do a lot better than Ramos this time.

2 minutes ago, John_Brian_K said:

I wanted to start a thread about the Pistons, because for the first time in a while I am pretty excited to watch some games and see what they can do this year.

It has been since they traded Chauncey away since I have really paid attention.  I watched some with Griffin and Drummond, but not much.  

I am planning on watching many more games this year.  I Hope they gel and win some games.

I'm still pretty pessimistic. Maybe Cade will be a franchise player and turn them around but if I just have had the feeling all along he has been oversold. Hope not though.

1 hour ago, oblong said:

That happens here in Dearborn where people are buying single story houses, knocking them down, save one wall to avoid it being called "New Construction",

yeah - some friends have a 2000 sq ft place on a lake up north with one old log cabin wall because of that. But more recently my BIL who has a  lakefront cottage that they were considering rebuilding into a 12 month home last year told me they've now done away with the old one wall rules. ☹️

1 hour ago, Motown Bombers said:

Michigan has an SEV value. If the market value of your house is $250k, than the SEV is $125K. Other states do it differently. My millage rate is 6.7% so the taxes would be 6.7% of $125k if that house were in Michigan. California, for example, does it by full value. Their rate is roughly 1% so the taxes would be 1% of $250k.

I spent a lot of time managing taxes and made mental notes of what blue states had the lowest property taxes in case I needed to flee. 

And of course the additional complication in MI is that your 'taxable' value can be significantly lower than the SEV because of PropA.

Quote

Proposal A dramatically decreased the amount of property taxes paid by Michigan residents and limited future increases. Starting in calendar year 1995, property taxes have been levied on taxable value instead of state equalized value. Taxable value increases are constitutionally limited to 5 percent or the rate of inflation, whichever is less. When a property is sold, the tax base reverts to state equalized value and annual taxable values are then capped once again.

For as long as you own a home, your tax increase is capped in an given year if property values increase faster than inflation or 5%. So over a number of years your tax basis can end up significantly less than the SEV.

California property taxes are low because voters passed 'Prop 2.5" a number of years ago. It caps property taxes based on 2.5% of the property value, and I think that like in MI that is actually 2.5% of  50%.

57 minutes ago, Archie said:

I would try Kreidler first.  There could be others available that aren't top tier but better than what we have. I'm holding out hope for Correa.  I don't want to see them get stuck long term with Semien or Story especially for a lot of money. I don't think they're worth it.

At least a SS they have some options if they can't sign someone - even if they are poor options. It's catcher I worry more about because Haase will not due as a regular catcher for any extended period.

Congrats to MWG:  registered membership just hit 100 with Scottwood having joined just now.

3 minutes ago, romad1 said:

I wouldn't hold my breath but he is the problem.

He could could at least have a multi-pack a day cigarette habit or something. But apparently his vanity insures him staying a health nut. Crappy combination.

1 hour ago, lordstanley said:

If I understood Dan Dickerson correctly when he was going through off-season needs in the 8th inning today, he does expect that the Tigers will sign a Tier 1 pitcher. 

I'd rather see the money go to SS. Outs not converted by Tiger shortstops have dragged down the whole pitching staff - running pitch counts, shortening outings, taxed the BP. Or, put another way, I'd rather have Correa and a 2nd tier guy than Scherzer with Niko and Willi back.