mtutiger

Gotta take anything on state media with a grain of salt, but hard not to raise eyebrows to a comment like that

Not really an answer to your question, but lost in these conversations about the relationship between Russia and China is that China still does a lot of business with Europeans. And for as powerful as Russia is projected, the combined GDP of EU countries dwarfs that of Russia (1/6th of the entire world's GDP). There would be economic risk to China in the event of a tactical nuke, it stands to reason.

Perhaps Putin is more rational than you think he is. Doesn't mean he's trustworthy, but the correct response to a bully isn't to cower to him, its to stand up to him. You seem to be advocating for cowering.

This kinda sums it up in terms of the media reponse... My guess is that Biden, by virtue of pursuing a policy that north of 75% of Americans agree with (ie. providing weapons of Ukraine but not engaging) gives them very little to work with, so moments where he says something provocative (which may or may not be a mistake depending on one's perspective) present an opportunity to create drama

I get it. I don’t know that it was the right choice of words. Just wish members of the media (and certain members of the board) were capable of some perspective. Its not the biggest gaffe in history, it will not lead to WWIII, etc.

FWIW, I stand by my initial comment that I'm not sure it was the right thing to say. I dont know that much is gained by it. But I do think Biden's critics are making a mountain out of a molehill when they hysterically say that we are gonna end up committed to a war over those nine words. Get a grip.

Almost makes as much sense as the US being a laughing stock while NATO is more united than anytime since at least 9/11. Maybe I come across harsh, but the arguments are just bad.

Talk is cheap, Archie...

I have watched both speeches and they are quite similar in their boldness and willingness to call out the enemy. And frankly, your hysterical reaction after Biden's are similar to a lot of Reagan's Dem critics at the time (ie. That madman is gonna get us into a war). Nonetheless, you seem committed to continuing to say that we are seen as a laughing stock, despite the fact that NATO is now more united than any time since at least 9/11. I'm sorry, but in all of your posts, you just seem to start from a conclusion and work backwards, rather than taking in the facts and coming to a conclusion. There's not a single issue that happens where I do not know what your position will be the moment it happens. It's hard to take that seriously... maybe try coming to your own conclusions based on the facts and not just providing a boiler plate response to everything. Otherwise, it seems like it would be difficult to have a good faith discussion.

Interesting thread

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_Empire_speech#Speech "Yes, let us pray for the salvation of all of those who live in that totalitarian darkness—pray they will discover the joy of knowing God. But until they do, let us be aware that while they preach the supremacy of the State, declare its omnipotence over individual man, and predict its eventual domination of all peoples on the earth, they are the focus of evil in the modern world .... So, in your discussions of the nuclear freeze proposals, I urge you to beware the temptation of pride—the temptation of blithely declaring yourselves above it all and label both sides equally at fault, to ignore the facts of history and the aggressive impulses of an evil empire, to simply call the arms race a giant misunderstanding and thereby remove yourself from the struggle between right and wrong and good and evil." Ronald Reagan, 1983. Somehow the world did not end after this speech. Nor will it after Biden's

It appears that, to the surprise of (almost) no one, Biden's statement isn't the beginning of World War III.

I would define weakness as being deathly scared that Joe Biden saying something that 80% of the world (and most world leaders) agree with as being something that would start World War III. I'll leave it at that... saying "Joe Biden is weak" over and over again while providing no arguments in favor of your hypothesis is not convincing. What is pretty convincing, however, is the idea that one can talk about strength while protecting weakness... which seems well summed up by someone who lives in the most powerful country in the world projecting fear of the actions of a second rate dictator who has completely FUBAR'd the invasion of a country 1/3rd it's size. You can talk a good game... but that's all it is, talk.

Seems pretty lunatic

Doesn't mean that it is either...

We aren't going to war. You can quote me on that. The President saying something that 80+% of the world agrees with and something I've heard versions of in my everyday life isn't going to change that. The fact that you think a quip like that would instigate that, however, really projects weakness. Maybe grow a spine and stop treating Vladimir Putin as being impregnable.

Why are you so afraid of Vladimir Putin? Your philosophy seems really weak and beta, tbh

Your post stands as a reminder of, if we were ever going to have a star player of his caliber, how lucky we have been to have him as our star. He has had his personal demons, but on the whole he’s a good egg. And he seems intent on playing that mentor role for the next generation

Totally. And not just opponents, but also the fact that his gaffes would be framed as being part of his appeal to the base and whatnot. Very similar to how Putin gets treated in the press

This kinda gets to something I have seen all the time prior to this war... the almost standard assumption that every piece of leverage is asymmetrical in a way that advantages Russia. Place sanctions on Russia? Can't do that, they'll pull Russian gas that the Germans et. al need (despite the fact that if Germans et. al aren't buying gas, Russia doesn't make any money). Give weapons to Ukraine? Can't do that, we risk Putin shooting off a nuke (despite MAD / our own nukes). It's almost like the entire world gaslit themselves into thinking this guy is impregnable and cannot be stood up to. And even as we have learned over the past month that he's not, some still seem to be doing this. He can still do a lot of bad, but people need to stiffen their spines a little more. The past month has told us that he's not a God.

Its really telling that his two biggest gaffes since this conflict (ie. "Putin is a war criminal", "Putin shouldn't remain") are things that I could have easily heard over the water cooler at work any day since 24 Feb. Like you suggest, Putin has enough problems on his plate.

I like the comparison to The Crown, it seems apt. I will say that I find it really weird that supporters of the Republican Party, which gave us Reagan, just seem really wobbly about Putin. Now, I get that he has nukes and that is important and all, but even after a largely failed first month of this conflict and a domestic situation that seems far weaker for them, on account of sanctions, there is still this desire to walk on eggshells in regards to this guy. I keep bringing up Reagan because, if that guy were around today, he wouldn't be doing that. He wouldn't be worried about Putin's feelings or emotions. I could easily see him giving a speech and saying something as forceful or even more forceful. I dunno, it's just strange to see people talking about how the world is "laughing at us" and how we are "weak" who simultaneously seem to live in fear of Putin's shadow.

I would just add that, iirc, Reagan, who many look back on as the guy who ended the Cold War, used to generate a lot of comments from his opposition that his comments/actions could land us in hot water. Yet we turned out OK there. Same may be true in this case as well.

I understand. In the grand scheme of things, its something for Biden Derangement Syndrome types to latch onto but isn't the end of the world. In the grand scheme of things, he's done a good job... the world is united (ie. not laughing) in opposition to the dictator. We are giving the Ukrainians what they need to fight back. We are hitting back with sanctions that bite. Given that, I can live with the occasional rhetorical mistake. And I dont think anything that Biden has said to date has done anything to push us closer to a world war...

You must be senile 😛