9/23/25 7:05 Tigers @ Guardians

[tiger2022]

18 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said:

Heck, I'm still waiting on them to spend the Cabrera money we were told was coming off the books to spend. 

Ilitch bought a house in the off season in the Bahamas, so he put that money to good use I suppose.

[chasfh]

3 hours ago, Sports_Freak said:

I don't see any of this getting done. The bean counters will say it's too expensive. Heck, I'm still waiting on them to spend the Cabrera money we were told was coming off the books to spend. 

[chasfh]

3 hours ago, tiger2022 said:

Your comment seemed to imply that Avila was worthless as a GM.  I wasn't a huge fan, but it was his guy's that took the team to the playoffs last year and had the best record in baseball until a month ago.  Other than Torres, Flaherty, and the bullpen (which has a high turnover rate), every player that has positively contributed anything over the last 2 years has been an Avila player.

Harris has virtually done nothing to help the mlb roster at all over the last 2 years.  Other than Torres, his FA signings have been awful if they even saw the field at all, sold at last year's deadline (which was fine), got Trey Sweeney, and got 2 of the worst starters in mlb at the deadline this year.

I am pretty sure he could have did virtually anything else and it would have turned out better.

He talks a great game for sure.

 

So, can’t name any genius moves Harris should have made that would have prevented our slide. Got it.

[tiger2022]

14 minutes ago, chasfh said:

So, can’t name any genius moves Harris should have made that would have prevented our slide. Got it.

Sure because I am in a position to actually make trades for the Tigers.  I can throw out silly trades just like anyone but I have no idea what another team would accept in a trade 

So because I don't come out with some far-fetched fantasy baseball type of trade, Harris must be amazing?  I'm not a mlb GM.  It's not my job to sit and study other team's rosters and call other teams up to find out about their players.  I have no idea what it would have taken to get some players via trade.  But Harris ended up with a guy who had been washed up for 3 years and a guy who had basically a 5.00 era for the last 6 years.  I have no idea how even the most devoted Harris slappies could even defend those deals 

All I know the Tigers went into the season with Trey Sweeney and Jace Jung as the SS-3rd base combo.  Two guys that were obviously not mlb caliber players.  It almost seems like Harris doesn't care about the mlb team because his guys are all in A ball and AA and if the Tigers fail, he'll just say it wasn't his fault because those aren't his guys.  

Edited September 24 by tiger2022

[Sports_Freak]

16 minutes ago, chasfh said:

So, can’t name any genius moves Harris should have made that would have prevented our slide. Got it.

Pay Boyd $30 million for 2 years instead of Cobb $15 million for one season, for starters. I'm sure there were other starting pitchers available that he didn't go after. (Or couldn't)

Be more aggressive with Boras over Bregman. Make an offer in November and give him a week to decide. Turn it down? Find another 3rd baseman. What did we get? Boras dragged his feet and all the other players were signed or already traded. And Harris saying "Oh well, I tried."

Look. I get your opinion. Harris was in charge when we started contending. And we all like being in a division race. But I have to agree with others, Harris didn't really do much to build this roster. So all he had to do was to add a few quality players to the roster full of Avlila's players. And at that he's failed miserably. Sure, give him another off-season to acquire the needed players to get us over the hump. I don't have much faith that he'll be able to but he's our best chance.

[Sports_Freak]

19 minutes ago, tiger2022 said:

Sure because I am in a position to actually make trades for the Tigers.  I can throw out silly trades just like anyone but I have no idea what another team would accept in a trade 

So because I don't come out with some far-fetched fantasy baseball type of trade, Harris must be amazing?  I'm not a mlb GM.  It's not my job to sit and study other team's rosters and call other teams up to find out about their players.  I have no idea what it would have taken to get some players via trade.  But Harris ended up with a guy who had been washed up for 3 years and a guy who had basically a 5.00 era for the last 6 years.  I have no idea how even the most devoted Harris slappies could even defend those deals 

All I know the Tigers went into the season with Trey Sweeney and Jace Jung as the SS-3rd base combo.  Two guys that were obviously not mlb caliber players.  It almost seems like Harris doesn't care about the mlb team because his guys are all in A ball and AA and if the Tigers fail, he'll just say it wasn't his fault because those aren't his guys.  

I don't usually agree with negative posts but this one makes sense. If the Tigers slide continues into next season, heads should roll. They prolly won't, but they should.

[Graterol]

So on brand for Team Harris that Rafael Montero is our bullpen hope and loads the bases.

Other than drafting McGonigle, is there a single move he has made that now looks good? I guess Finnigan. Torres looks solid but nowhere near as much of a steal 2 months ago.

Canha, Urshela, Maeda, Brebbia, Cobb, Urquidy, Morton, Paddack, Kahnle, Montero. 

The Flaherty trade is mediocre with Sweeney and Liranzo ****ting the bed.

E Rod fiasco. 

Saying McGonible needs to develop and trotting out negative WAR sweeeeny, if nothing else to do something to show he is trying. Not trying to win now.

Now that we have two full years, not sure his tenure looks great. Too much focus on development for the theoretical future when playoffs are now. Too much of the smartest guy in the room so let’s sign a bunch of cheap **** instead of paying market price for some better talent.

[chasfh]

12 hours ago, tiger2022 said:

Sure because I am in a position to actually make trades for the Tigers.  I can throw out silly trades just like anyone but I have no idea what another team would accept in a trade 

So because I don't come out with some far-fetched fantasy baseball type of trade, Harris must be amazing?  I'm not a mlb GM.  It's not my job to sit and study other team's rosters and call other teams up to find out about their players.  I have no idea what it would have taken to get some players via trade.  But Harris ended up with a guy who had been washed up for 3 years and a guy who had basically a 5.00 era for the last 6 years.  I have no idea how even the most devoted Harris slappies could even defend those deals 

All I know the Tigers went into the season with Trey Sweeney and Jace Jung as the SS-3rd base combo.  Two guys that were obviously not mlb caliber players.  It almost seems like Harris doesn't care about the mlb team because his guys are all in A ball and AA and if the Tigers fail, he'll just say it wasn't his fault because those aren't his guys.  

That’s fine, you don’t have to come up with anything they might have done differently. It’s not as though we know any better than they do. And you’re right, you’re not a mlb GM. It’s not your job. You don’t have to have a serious discussion with other fans just because they ask you to, or otherwise talk about or have to think about possible remedies that might would have been better than what they did. You can just continue to yell at the clouds about it. That’s a fan’s privilege and a fan’s prerogative.

[tiger2022]

22 minutes ago, chasfh said:

That’s fine, you don’t have to come up with anything they might have done differently. It’s not as though we know any better than they do. And you’re right, you’re not a mlb GM. It’s not your job. You don’t have to have a serious discussion with other fans just because they ask you to, or otherwise talk about or have to think about possible remedies that might would have been better than what they did. You can just continue to yell at the clouds about it. That’s a fan’s privilege and a fan’s prerogative.

Once again, I can throw out trades or FA signings but I have no idea how much money I would need to throw at a player or what I would need to give up to get a player.  

But you are right if you were implying that I don't know exactly what Harris tried to do, but I do know what he did accomplish was underwhelming and didn't help the current mlb roster.

I could have tried to trade for Devers when he was upset.  The guy is a great hitter and he can't be any worse defensively than Jung or Keith, the two guys that were the serious 3rd baseman candidates.  I would have traded some good prospects for him.  Probably not Clark or McGongle, but everyone else would have been available.  But Boston mat not have wanted to trade him to Detroit.  Devers may not have wanted to come to Detroit.  I would have made a serious effort.  I doubt if Harris even considered it.

Before the season, I would have stocked Toledo with depth at starting pitcher instead of signing guys that were injured.  Guys that may have been career minor leaguers who can come up and give you innings and start a few games if needed.  These guys wouldn't be studs but the Tigers had no one.

No way would Ihave started the season with Sweeney as my shortstop.  Harris did so because he traded for him and wanted to show how he fleeced the Dodgers in the trade.    

At the deadline the A's were willing to deal pretty much any if their pitchers.  Those guys were all better options than Morton and Paddack.  I have no idea if Harris inquired about them.  But it probably would have taken a mid level prospect package to get any of them or several of them.

I think the team also lacks leadership, and that is showing right now.  There doesn't seem to be any players stepping up and Hinch fancies himself as a leader but he was fired in both his previous jobs because he had no control or authority in the clubhouse.  

 

I would have looked into adding Andrew McCutchen at the break.  He's a leader and a solid if not great bat.

Edited September 25 by tiger2022

[chasfh]

51 minutes ago, tiger2022 said:

Once again, I can throw out trades or FA signings but I have no idea how much money I would need to throw at a player or what I would need to give up to get a player.  

But you are right if you were implying that I don't know exactly what Harris tried to do, but I do know what he did accomplish was underwhelming and didn't help the current mlb roster.

I could have tried to trade for Devers when he was upset.  The guy is a great hitter and he can't be any worse defensively than Jung or Keith, the two guys that were the serious 3rd baseman candidates.  I would have traded some good prospects for him.  Probably not Clark or McGongle, but everyone else would have been available.  But Boston mat not have wanted to trade him to Detroit.  Devers may not have wanted to come to Detroit.  I would have made a serious effort.  I doubt if Harris even considered it.

Before the season, I would have stocked Toledo with depth at starting pitcher instead of signing guys that were injured.  Guys that may have been career minor leaguers who can come up and give you innings and start a few games if needed.  These guys wouldn't be studs but the Tigers had no one.

No way would Ihave started the season with Sweeney as my shortstop.  Harris did so because he traded for him and wanted to show how he fleeced the Dodgers in the trade.    

At the deadline the A's were willing to deal pretty much any if their pitchers.  Those guys were all better options than Morton and Paddack.  I have no idea if Harris inquired about them.  But it probably would have taken a mid level prospect package to get any of them or several of them.

I think the team also lacks leadership, and that is showing right now.  There doesn't seem to be any players stepping up and Hinch fancies himself as a leader but he was fired in both his previous jobs because he had no control or authority in the clubhouse.  

 

I would have looked into adding Andrew McCutchen at the break.  He's a leader and a solid if not great bat.

See, there you go.

I don't think I would have traded for Devers. Yes he can hit, but he is a terrible third baseman, which is why the Giants are moving him off third and to first, and we already have a first baseman. Plus he seems like a bit of a prima donna malcontent, and that's a bad fit for a team like ours. Again, I know he's a great hitter, even though he's tailed off in Frisco, but especially given his money—it did take Frisco to pick up his entire remaining $300-ish million to acquire him—I don't think I would have wanted to commit to him for the next eight years.

Although one thing I don't understand is how it's possible on the one hand to speculate that Devers did not want to come here and/or the Red Sox did not want to trade him here, yet criticize Harris for not going after him even though we don't know he didn't. That doesn't seem exactly fair, but again, fan prerogative. 

I believe the front office did think we had depth in the system at SP. We had K Montero, W Hernandez, Melton, SGL, Enns, and a few others backing up our starting five. I think that looked reasonable at the time. In retrospect we had a lot more injuries and there was more ineffectiveness than we hoped to see. That just happens sometimes in today's game. I'm not sure how many more guys we needed to have down there, but I'd guess that one could say no matter what the number is, it would never have been enough, because you can never have enough. Not enough starting pitching in a team's organization is a tale old as baseball itself.

In hindsight, it's true the Sweeney was terrible, although there was no reason to believe he would be this bad when the season started. If I'm going to fault the front office, it's that we did not have shortstops at higher levels, and really, they should have seen that Kreidler was never going to be the answer. I think the hope was that Sweeney would be enough bridge us to McGonigle and then eventually Bryce Rainer (remember that guy?) when it was time for them to arrive, but that blew up on us. Not sure that could have been foreseen.

The A's got a king's ransom in prospects from the Padres for Mason Miller, including the guy who's #3 MLB overall just behind McGonigle and ahead of Max Clark. I don't know whether you're suggesting we should have traded either of those guys for Mason Miller, but I think we're going to be glad we didn't.

Andrew McCutchen, just ... nahh.

Thanks.