buddha

They should sign or draft better ones.

7 hours ago, Deleterious said:

 

i'd much rather play toronto than cleveland.

56 minutes ago, Hongbit said:

100% agree the players aren’t good enough but I think it would quicker and easier to get back to  respectability with a different system.  

you could be right, i dont know enough about hockey to know.  

1 hour ago, 1984Echoes said:

I didn't do a good enough job explaining myself (my bad) so let me try again...

I'm calling this: "What I WANTS" (think... BECK!!!):

1) I WANT SY to go ALL OUT and sign Alex Tuch this offseason. Pay him what he wants. Overpay him. I WANTS a top-line of Larkin-Raymond-Tuch. And if Raymond wilts in the back half of the season again... I am perfectly fine with a Kasper-Larkin-Tuch top line. IMO.

2) The second line would be Copp-Cat-Finnie, unless SY and Kane want him back here for another season. I am OK with either way. He's still got it... but what I WANTS, is for our 3rd line (Kasper-Danielson-MBN) to PUSH HIGHER and become our 2nd line. Even giving our top line a run for the money. But that's up to them, and McLellan to GET them there. They have to get THEMSELVES there... and I'm OK if they only show themselves to be a good 2nd line and that's it. They haven't even shown that yet, however.

But I'm running them together and pushing them hard the entire year. IMO.

3) SY can find a couple checking BANGERS with little to no (or possibly even "some") offense; simply to take on 1st lines and hound them. To add some "grit" on this team. Appleton can center them until someone better pops up on their radar screen. Maybe next trade deadline SY can find someone to better the team either by pushing Copp down here or a guy who adds offense as well as grit to the 4th line. A lot of "To be determined" on this line... but that's OK.

4) 1st pair is Mo-Edvinsson, that's easy... And I think Simon has a lot of room to grow. What I WANTS, is for Buium to earn, and take over, 2nd pairing with Faulk next year. I think Buium benefits hugely from having Faulk as his 1st NHL partner. And vice verse. Chiarot looked like a bad fit with Faulk. Buium needs to step up, IMO.

5) That pushes Chiarot to 3rd pair. Perfect. He was a good match for ASP. But ASP needs to grow on defense. Too much a sieve. Too bad we can't squish JBD (bigger, more responsible defensively, little-to-no-offense) and ASP (LITERALLY, the opposite of JBD) into one player. McLellan may even be forced to dress 7 defensemen and protect ASP by using him on PP's and offensive zone whilst swapping him out for JBD for defensive zone play. So I WANTS ASP to improve significantly on defense; although we just might not get that and be stuck with a JBD-ASP matchup game.

6) I WANTS Wallinder and Cossa on the Red Wings roster the entire year. They either figure out the NHL, or not. If Wallinder is responsible enough defensively, maybe he can take some 3rd pair games away from Chiarot on back-to-backs. If McLellan could convince him to play harder/ (tougher)... maybe he could get more playing time than that. But if all he turns into is a 7th defenseman, we'll just have to live with that. And I am perfectly fine with that. Let him sit in the press box. If he wants to earn soem NHL ice time, PLAY TOUGHER!!! As for Cossa, I do NOT need him to be amazing, I just want him to be NHL-blooded, for a full season. To be a good 1B to Gibson's 1A. I WANTS Cossa to take over the 1A from Gibson... but I can be patient on that end... at least for a little while.

 

So my big SY moves this offseason are: Clearing roster space. Signing Tuch (OVERPAY if you MUST Stevie!!!). And putting it all on the kids... to sink or swim.

But that's just me.

It's "What I WANT"...!

 

 

if you want that many rookies, you are looking at another tank.  look at finnie, danielson, kasper, and asp this year.

finnie started strong when he was playing with healthy larkin/raymond but fell off dramatically.  every other rookie was bad to borderline unplayable.

To the point jason makes, its possible that yzerman always saw this season as another bridge year.  blood some rookies and they'll be ready for larger roles next season and the year after.

i question whether that's true and the real reason the rookies havent been brought up is because theyre injured (mazur, buium) or not developing fast enough to make a difference now (danielson, asp), or blocked (cossa).

its not the system, the players just arent good enough.

the problem with a trade now is that you dealt away a lottery pick for justin faulk.  so you dont have the first to trade anymore and i dont know how comfortable i am with dealing another first rounder unless youre getting a star back.

we can rewind to hongbit's argument (and max bultman's argument) about quinn hughes.  should he have given up edvinsson for hughes?  i didnt think so at the time and i still have reservations about it.

that said, they need 5x5 offense and hughes/seider would bring that.

the problem is that i dont think it would be enough because the rest of the team would still suck.  as weve seen.  and more than that, the STARS of the team have sucked.  THAT'S the real reason theyve tanked in march/april the last two seasons.  larkin and raymond havent been good enough.  

and the other reason being yzerman hasnt signed enough good secondary players to help them.  debrincat, yes.  but debrincat fell into his lap.  he could have re-signed gosthisbhere but didnt.  he could have kept walman.  traded for guentzel.  done SOMETHING other than sign quite marginal players.

they signed a 60 year old jvr to PLAY ON THE FIRST LINE!  only finnie's early season hot streak bailed them out there.  and finnie has been bad for most of the second half of the season.

you would have to attach assets to trade compher or rasmussen.  copp might get you a pick, but copp can still play.  i wouldnt want to trade copp for a low round draft pick.

johannson might get you a 4th round pick or so.  maybe a 3rd.  what did maata get?  that's what i would expect johannson to fetch.

and what does that do for you?  not much.

good that cade is back.  no need to work him too hard in a game where the other team is actively trying to lose.

the last time michigan won a basketball national championship the pistons won the nba title...

hey look, were in last place.

i understand the argument jason is making and that potential timeline, but if that IS the timeline, i dont think theyre actually on it.

seider is an all star.  raymond is close.  edvinsson has potential.

but kasper?  danielson?  asp?  cossa?  are they on that kind of track?  if not, its not going to matter when compher comes off the books if youre just replacing him with compher 2.0.

and if that WAS the timeline, then why did they trade for perron a few years ago and aign gosthisbere?  those guys were old then.  then they let them go and tried to replace them and failed.

i think yzerman is on a seider/raymond timeline, not a larkin timeline.  but seider/raymond's clock has started and he didnt do anything this year to help move it along.

the more worrying part is kasper and danielson (and they already complained about lack of 2nd round hits when you had 6 chances).  those guys have to hit.  they HAVE to.  and they have looked like average players so far.  if they are, this rebuild goes nowhere.

37 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

I get it but his timeline is not the fan timeline. That is the real point. 

I believe his timeline (and Ilitch’s) is when C/C/R come off the books.

compher isnt coming off the books for another 2 years. 

so we continue to dabble around the margins until larkin is 31?

45 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

I'll grant Cossa has been inconsistent, but he was simply outstanding for a long stretch in GR, there is some kind of talent there. Maybe playing 2nd string would have been exactly how to break him in successfully. But we'll never know.

every goalie in grand rapids has been amazing.  so do his numbers say cossa is amazing, or that grand rapids defense is amazing?

i would love to see cossa in detroit.  unless they trade him, he WILL be in detroit next year.  

it could be yzerman being too conservative, or it could be that - like danielson, and like asp - he's not ready or not that good.

34 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

There was enough smoke around him being involved in conversations about trades for a couple of high end forwards that I believe he was trying to pull off something big. I don’t expect he will be a big player in FA until he gets Copp/Compher/ Rasmussen off the books. But I expect he will revisit potential trades over the summer and I don’t rule out the possibility that he could surprise us. 

sure.  but he didnt pull it off.  that's the point.

21 minutes ago, lordstanley said:

The Habs have three goalies - Montembault, Dobes and Fowler - and will get rid of one. Dobes is a 24 year old 5th rounder and Fowler is a 21 year old 3rd rounder. Fowler and Dobes both have trade value because both have been allowed to build up a portfolio of NHL starts. 16 games for Fowler this season, 40 games for Dobes this season after Fowler last season. Cossa could have played 20 games this season instead of Talbot, sink or swim.  If Yzerman and McLelland suspected he would fail, let's stop pretending and ditch him on someone before the rest of the NHL finds out, if they haven't already.

we all said the same thing about asp and danielson and they both kind of sucked at the nhl level.

i'm down on stevie right now but i'm not sure bringing up the rookies would have made a positive difference this year.

2 hours ago, Jason_R said:

 

I think Steve was looking to make a big deal at the deadline for a top forward and I expect him to fill that gap this summer. I also expect we will see the team move on from at least one under-performing vet. 

we all said the same thing last summer and we signed mason appleton and JVR.

6 hours ago, Deleterious said:

 

who are 5 guys who will never do **** in the nba.

next year's draft class isnt as good, i wonder if we'll still see as much blatant tanking?

8 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

Somewhere, lost in all the Noise and Chaos that is the current US government, there now are  proposals beginning percolate between the Admin and the Senate, and enough interest that something may yet emerge. They could take some of the issues out the court jurisdiction, possibly rationalize things a bit, or just make it all worse! But in any case, I don't think we need to worry about the current state being the final word for college sports.

no, but this admin isnt organized enough to do anything about it.

Just now, Mr.TaterSalad said:

I hate the way the system is, but it's how it is. Dusty May is doing what I pleaded for years for Harbaugh to do. He's doing it the SEC way and finding success because he's a great coach himself. It's really ****ty that this is what college athletics has become, but at least Michigan finally caught up in the NIL era. 

once you made it legal, you opened the door to sports obsessed schools with huge, rich alumni to open their pocketbooks.  michigan, ohio state, indiana...

it was always a benefit to michigan once they got comfortable with the idea.  now that they are, you see them winning.

with that said, dusty may was the biggest part of that.  football has more money than god but couldnt get out of its own way, michigan put together a great team, and then coached them well enough to win.

dusty earned that big ol raise he's about to get.  

the big ten is champs in football, mens bball, and womens bball.

Money talks.

6 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

UConn hung about as tough as you could and still lose.

So, is Warde Manuel still a moron for Sharrone Moore or a genius for Dusty May?  

yes

40 minutes ago, Hongbit said:

Nearly every NBA player will want to be in Chicago again now that Josh Giddey is there toying with the rest of the league.   

did he steal those toys from his 15 year old "friends?"

normally i would assume keith gave is supporting mcclellan because mclellan is giving him information, but gave is retired, right?  maybe larkin talks to him still.

he's right to call out yzerman.  its just the same stuff we've all been saying for the last couple of years, but some of us (me) gave yzerman a long leash until this year's collapse finally pushed everyone over rhe edge.

what did we say last year: why is rasmussen still on this team?  kane was "fine", but is he a guy busting his ass every night?  compher is everyone's whipping boy.  copp has disappeared.  jvr and appleton are depth passengers.

they have been very conservative.

keith gave coming out strong!