4hzglory

21 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

The Lions currently have over $30 million in cap space. Teams can roll over unused cap space. There has to be a reason the Lions are keeping so much cap space. I don't believe they have signed Arnold or Rakestraw yet so that will eat into the space a little. 

Maybe they are looking to extend Decker for a year as part of it?  
 

The rolling over definitely makes sense also.  It definitely gives them flexibility.

3 hours ago, Motown Bombers said:

Over the Cap has Goff's contract details. He has a nearly $70 million cap hit in 2026. They lowered his cap hit in 2024 by $5 million. The Lions already had a lot of cap space. I'm hoping they have some mechanism in place to lower that cap hit in 2026. There doesn't appear to be void years so I think they can add void years. 

What they did though, is give them a bit of an out in 2026 if things would fall apart as even though they would have a dead money hit of over $63 million, it is still less than his cap number and could be spread over 2 years.  It leaves a bit more flexibility in a worst case scenario and they have options to lower the hit if things continue to go well.

3 hours ago, Motown Bombers said:

Over the Cap has Goff's contract details. He has a nearly $70 million cap hit in 2026. They lowered his cap hit in 2024 by $5 million. The Lions already had a lot of cap space. I'm hoping they have some mechanism in place to lower that cap hit in 2026. There doesn't appear to be void years so I think they can add void years. 

Yeah they can definitely add void years and switch his 2026 salary to bonus if they want as well.

15 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Goff's contract is really a 3 year deal and seems front loaded.

 

So assuming they added a void year, the signing bonus allocation would be just over $12 mil per year (this year, the 4 year extension and the void year)

so if they need to move on him after year 3, there would be 24.3 mil in SB allocation left plus it appears $5 mil in guaranteed $ so a total of around $29 million dead money that could be spread over 2 years-very manageable.   If they didn’t add a void year, the annual bonus allocation goes up to $14.6 million which means the dead money would be left after year 3 of the extension (4years from now) would be $19.6 million (assuming $5 million of the last year is guaranteed to get to the total $170 guaranteed)

Obviously he may be restructured throughout which may affect the ending cap hit, but it could be very manageable at the end.  He will also still only be Cousin’s age in 6 years to it may be extended again.

12 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

Interesting.  Have assumed so far that it was mostly about Keith's move to 2b blocking him there. 

From pipeline’s write up on Jung

That’s if he sticks at second base. Jung was a surprise Rawlings Minor League Gold Glove winner given his pre-Draft reputation, but he impressed Tigers officials and Minor League managers with his ability to handle what’s hit to him with his good hands. However, his lack of range limits his defensive ceiling up the middle, and his trial at third coincided with Colt Keith getting looks at the keystone. Jung’s offensive ability is too good to ignore, and should he keep hitting the right benchmarks, he'll remain valuable in the lineup regardless of his defensive spot.

2 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

any kind of background noise at all about trying Jung at SS? It seems like a if a guy can play 3B he's got some arm,  and if he can play 2B he's got a little glove, and your system's need for a SS is close to dire, it might be worth at least an audition.

One of the reasons they moved him to 3rd was his lack of range-don’t think Short is an option at all.

2 hours ago, oblong said:

The thing with Tork is sure a puzzle but I'm not sure what can be done.  Anything a writer or person twitter or the internet can say or offer is obviously already known to the team and to him. Sometimes the body can't or won't do what it needs to do.  Hitting is hard. 

Hey, he is on pace for 50 doubles…and obviously 0 homers. 🤦🏻

Here would be a sample deal to show what MB is saying.

Goff currently has a cap hit of $32.3 mil for 2024 with 22.3 in salary, 5 mil roster bonus and 5 mil prorated signing bonus.

A proposed 4 year $200 mil extension with $90 mil signing bonus and $125 mil guaranteed new money could look like something like this.  

If they add a void year, the signing bonus would get spread over 6 years - current 2024, 4 year extension, plus the 1 void year.  So the signing bonus allocation would be $15 mil per year.

2024:  convert $15 mil of his $27.3 mil salary/roster bonus to new signing bonus.  Cap hit would be $12.3 mil salary, $5 mil from previous signing bonus + $15 mil new signing bonus allocation for total cap hit of $32.3 mil - identical to current.

2025: Fully guaranteed salary of $15 mil + $15 mil signing bonus allocation for cap hit of $30 mil

2026:  Fully guaranteed salary of $20 mil + $15 mil signing bonus allocation for cap hit of $35 mil

2027:  Salary of $35 mil ($15 mil fully guaranteed - gets to the $125mil guaranteed new money) + $15 mil signing bonus allocation for cap hit of $50 mil

2028:  Salary of $40 mil + signing bonus allocation for cap hit of $55 mil

2029 void year:  signing bonus allocation of $15 mil for cap hit of $15 mil

So proposed cap hits of $32.3 mil in 2024 (identical to current), $30 mil in 2025, $35 mil in 2026 - almost an identical average for those 3 years as his 2024 hit.

Obviously they would have roster bonus'/other ways of adjusting the hits if they wanted more cap space in certain years, but this would also allow them to get out of the deal after 2026 if they had to for a dead money hit of $60 million which is $10 million more than what his 2027 cap number would be if they kept him, or they could spread it over 2 years and free up $20 million in 2027, $25 mil in 2028, and $15 mil in 2029.  If they cut him after 2027, they would have a dead money hit of $30 mil which if they didn't spread it over 2 years, would save them $25 mil on the cap  in 2028 and $15 mil in 2029. - so no major pill like the Hurts deal.

This is just a lot to say/show that a 4 yr $200 mil extension can simply be structured to not cripple the cap.  The team would have many other roster bonuses/etc to further manipulate the cap numbers besides this.

42 minutes ago, Jimbo said:

.  I also look at what I feel like other teams would pay for him if he was a free agent. Non of that matters if we win a Superbowl or are contenders for it for the next few years.

I think Cousin's deal shows that he would likely get at least around 4 yrs $200 mil on the open market.

I definitely don't want them to go crazy, but IMO he has earned around that and whenever he signs, his first 2 years will likely be at a similar or lower cap hit than he has had the last 2 seasons.  It would be the last couple years where the cap hit would increase, but by then the cap will be significantly higher as well. 

24 minutes ago, oblong said:

and this affects all teams on Bally who's customers are Xfinity.

I'm listening on the app now.  I tried mlb.tv but it's blacked out.

Yes, we are in Florida and got the notice from Xfinity also.  Fortunately we can watch Tiger games on MLBTV except when they are in Tampa.

42 minutes ago, RedRamage said:

If you're grading on a curve, yeah. But this is kinda like the PFF method of grading. Each pick can only get an A+ grade. ARSB should be like an A+++++++++ grade. Top 10 player at his position in round 4? Yeah, that's big time score! But if you can only be A+ per pick, then you average all the picks, you come out with an A- because of Levi.

Having said that, this isn't probably the best way to grade a draft.

How about this:

All Pro:  100%

Pro Bowl:  95%

Starter on playoff caliber team:  90%

Starter on team like the 2021 Lions/ solid rotational player currently 80%

Special Teams contributer/still on roster contributing10-25% of snaps:  70%

Still on roster, barely contributing:  60%

Contributed some over years, but not on current roster: 50%

Not in Football:  F

Round bonus:

Round 1:  0% Round 2:  5% Round 3: 10% Round 4: 15% Round 5: 20% Round 6: 25% Round 7: 30%, FA: 35%

So 2021:

Sewell:  100% + 0 bonus = 100%

Levi: 60% + 5% bonus = 65%

Aim:  95% + 10% = 105%

Iffy:  80% + 15% = 95%

St Brown:  100% + 20% = 120%

Barnes: 80% + 20% = 100%

Jefferson:  50% + 35% = 85%

Wright:  80% + 35%  =115%

Jacobs:  70% + 35% = 105%

Total 890%/9 = 98.89%

Definitely and A  to A+ 

16 minutes ago, MichiganCardinal said:

When Holmes traded Hock at 1-6, I remember he claimed that he would have done it even if we were 6-1. McNeill might test that.

If you can get a low-end first for him from a team like Miami, Houston, or Cincinnati, or a high-end second from Denver or New York (Giants), I think you have to think long and hard about it - if, and only if, you've decided you can't afford to keep him. You're not in desperation win-now-at-all-costs mode. If his replacement struggles, you're going to get flak for it, no doubt. But if you're Dan Campbell losing your best interior defender, you have to treat it just like you would a season-ending injury. Next man up.

It's probably accurate that it makes more sense to make the decision at the end of 2024, but you can't tag both McNeill and Decker. Hopefully they can extend at least one of them. I'd probably prefer Decker if I'm being honest, the offensive line is the heart of this team.

I don't think they will need to tag Decker.  He has already said he would love to do a deal and knows others need paid.   I also think there are other options at RT for a year if you would lose Decker and Sordsdal/Manu aren't ready.  I definitely don't see them signing him long term unless he takes a reasonable amount below what he could get on the market and they are only locked in for 2 more years.  Again, Decker's comments indicate that could happen, but I don't see him being franchised at all.

Also, they are in a completely different situation now than they were in 2022.  Even if they were 6-1 then, they knew they were not a championship calibar team.  They know they are now.

11 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Something that is rarely used but I think would be worth using with McNeil is the transition tag. It essentially makes him a restricted free agent and allows the Lions to match any offer sheet. Let him test the market and if it gets out of hand let him walk. 

I'd be surprised if they used it as the only compensation you would get would be the normal comp pick formula for lost FA's and with drafting Wingo I think the goal is to develop a more cost effective option long term.  I could see them paying McNeil for a year at the Franchise Tag #, but don't know they want to go long term at $25 mil +/yr that he would likely get on the market if he puts up another Pro Bowl caliber season.  Not that they don't like him, or he won't deserve it, just you can only pay so many guys top $.  Definitely the 1 problem with drafting so many guys that hit.  Obvious positive is, if you keep doing that, you can pay the guys you have to pay and keep bringing in/developing young guys to take the other's spots when they get too expensive.

15 minutes ago, buddha said:

you dont trade a player like that in a super bowl window.

and you cant pay everybody.

If he plays worth deserving it and they want, they can always franchise him next year and then trade him.

28 minutes ago, Motor City Sonics said:

Because my theory is you can't get a feel for a player for at least 3 years (some say 4),  These are my grades for the 2021 Detroit Lions Draft.

1st Round -  Needs to be a major contributor by year 2

2nd Round -  Needs to be a starter or rotational guy (double-digit snaps per weeK)

3rd Round -  Needs to be a plus player.   

4th Round -  Need to be a depth player you can count on from time to time

5th Round - If they can at least contribute on Special Teams,  Fine

6th Round / 7th Round -  If they can stick with the team at all for a season, It's positive

 

ROUND 1 - OT PENEI SEWELL   A+     One of the best in the game 

ROUND 2 - DT  LEVI ONWUZURIKE   D    Injuries derailed him (but they knew about that when they took him)

ROUND 3 -  DT  ALIM McNEIL  A+   A bona fide runstopper with more athleticism than his physique.  

ROUND 3  CB  IFFY MELIFONWU  B   Was a ghost until middle of last year and then looked great.  Tough position to learn, it takes time.  Sample size is too small for an  A

ROUND 4  WR AMON-RA ST. BROWN  A+    One of the best receivers in football.  Mr. Reliable and a drive that fits this staff perfectly.  This guy is the heart of the team on the players side.  

ROUND 4  LB  DERRICK BARNES  B.   Like Iffy, it's a tough position to learn quickly but we finally saw flashes of what he could be and he should get better

ROUND 7 RB JAMAR JEFFERSON   B    He gets a B because of where he was drafted.  He made the team and made some plays.  Can't ask for much more from a 7th rounder, honestly.  

 

A-

 

This was the best Lions draft BY FAR in my memory (going back to about 1977, 78).   The only thing that prevents it from getting an A+ was they continued the tradition of bad 2nd round picks, but that seemed to get corrected the next year.   They covered their mistake by taking the same position in round 3.       I mean, 3 All-Pro level players.    If only they'd nailed the 2nd round in 2021.  

2024 left me a little puzzled, but so did last year. 

Trust In Brad

 

2 All Pro players, 3 Pro Bowlers, 5 Starter/significant rotational players, everyone still on the team that should have won the NFC Championship game and the don’t get a straight A or A plus?   
 

so if St Brown was just a starter, but Levi was a significant rotational guy they would have gotten an A?  LOL

Just now, Mr.TaterSalad said:

I guess we're rolling with Badgley unless we sign a UDFA or bring in a camp body. 

There are still veteran FAs also

3 minutes ago, buddha said:

every team looks great on draft night.

And the Vikings have now traded 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round 2025 picks

28 minutes ago, Edman85 said:

That is not my recollection of 2012-2014. Not at all.

Yeah, we had a great starting 5 the vast majority of the playoff run.  It was the bullpen that was unpredictable.

6 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

He would still get cut. This in no way is job security for Cominsky because the cost to the Lions to cut him is still the same. 

Actually the cost is now $500k more for the Lions to cut him and he gets the $500k now that he wouldn’t otherwise.

15 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Armstead is the 2nd highest cap hit for the 49ers who are projected to be over the cap. They had to make a move. The Lions are well below the cap and asking players who they just signed to small contracts to take pay cuts. I'm surprised the NFLPA doesn't say something. 

The NFLPA doesn’t say anything because it’s common practice and the player would rather take the pay cut rather than be cut, not likely find a better contract and have to move.

if the player thinks they can get a better situation, they refuse the pay cut and are released.

Cominsky also got an extra $500k of his contract guaranteed and paid right away as a bonus.

5 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

The Lions have nearly $30 million in cap space even with the Carlton Davis $14 million cap hit but it was really important to get that extra $2 million in space from Cominsky. 

The bears had the most cap room and were cutting players.  

2 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Have the 49ers asked four players to do it in two years? 

Not sure- how many have they released?  You hear of teams asking guys to take ay cuts all the time and if they don’t, they cut them.  It isn’t a Lions only thing.

6 minutes ago, MichiganCardinal said:

Yes, but only if their contract is expiring. Like teams can't reach out and talk to Jared Goff, he's under contract. But as of Monday they could talk to CJGJ, whose contract expires today.

Arik Armstead is under contract, but it's already been announced he is going to be released by the 49ers because he refused to take a significant pay cut and he has a $28MM cap hit. Teams can't tamper with him though, because even though the Niners announced they're going to cut him, they haven't yet, so he's still under contract. There is a chance with him too that the 49ers wait until June 1st to cut him. They would spread out their dead cap implications to him if they do.

Wait, the 49ers asked him to take a pay cut?  I thought only the Lions did that.

5 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

This is not understood. This doesn't happen often in the NFL and the Lions are doing it way more than anyone else. On top of that, the Lions aren't even hurting for cap space and they are asking players to take pay cuts. Combined with not spending a lot on free agents and the Lions are going to get a reputation for being a cheap team. 

This does happen all the time in the NFL.  The Packers just did it with Aaron Jones who decided to take being cut and sign with the Vikings 

1 minute ago, 4hzglory said:

I believe they got this idea from the XFL or some other league anyway 

Yes, it was used in the XFL-first article that came up

https://www.sportingnews.com/ca/nfl/news/nfl-xfl-kickoff-rules-changes/vqjfcemjh6xexxygvslwha2r