chasfh

I already posted a link from a few years ago in another thread proving that Avila and Chadd took a flyer on Skubal not because their scouting told them anything special about him, but because Scott Boras suggested they do so. I wouldn’t imagine they put any more thought into picking Carpenter. I think they saw him as a decent-enough-looking guy on that board who had already been passed on 561 times, including 18 times by Avila himself.

Not only that, but every website with any scouting-based focus, from Pipeline to FanGraphs to BP to everyone in-between, had Spencer Torkelson as THE default 1/1 of that draft. Whether they all, to a man, swung and missed on his potential is irrelevant. What they were looking at was, who was the strongest candidate of that particular draft at that particular time (which, remember, was almost four years ago), and unanimously, it was Spork. So, really, it’s not fair cricket that four years later, or even 20 years later, see who retired with the best WAR, and say Avila 100% screwed the pooch in that draft because he didn’t pick [whoever that #1 WAR guy ends up being].

Meaning what? Picking them in the draft, or picking who outside the organization they should see to fix themselves?

Get better soon, Spork!

I missed that story, do you have a link, or else a source?

The problem with the idea was that there were cutting edge organizations that actually succeeded through tanking because they were the first to do it, and then the me-too orgs followed it like it was a plug-and-play formula they could just order off the shelf.

I also prefer it when people who criticize picks or trades or signings as being wrong then follow up with what they would have done instead. It gives us a sense of what those fans think is important, which makes debating them more fun, and they might even give us something to think about if they come up with a good alternative. Although, to be fair, many if not most fans are strictly emotional, so they shouldn’t be expected to debate such moves on intellectual terms. They can be simply reactive if they want, and that’s totally fine. It’s just that we don’t have to take their emotional ranting seriously, and we shouldn’t.

Because they went outside of Avila’s system and helped themselves.

Cool. I don’t mean to hammer you on it, but there are a lot of fans who do think they are dropping the ball on this, among other things, and would like to see mass releases and firings starting immediately, and I’m not always clear on where you stand on it.

When you say, “if the org didn’t believe Tork was capable of a lot more, maybe they should have moved on- and done something to fill the hole”, that implies to me that you believe the organization believes he is not capable a lot more, and that they are dropping the ball in not getting his replacement in house already. That’s why I asked the question. The Tigers have to believe Tork can be doing much better. He has a fairly extensive track record in college and the first few years of minors, plus his flash in last year’s second half. It’s far too soon to conclude that he will never hit at the big league level. They did not imagine going in that he would have regressed so terribly. That is why they are giving him rope, and also why they are sending him to Toledo instead of releasing him. But most importantly, this is why they don’t have a major league first baseman in house already. Orgs don’t generally have active tangible plans, the kind that cost resources, in place in case of unexpected abject failure.

I’m surprised, but sure, why not? As long as they can switch off between Canha and Urshela, unless they have something up their sleeve with the market, which I kind of doubt.

What a minute—where are you hearing that the organization does not believe Tork is capable of a lot more?

Maybe it's not the coaching, maybe it's the player. But sure, fire them all, I guess, and keep firing them until things improve.

Because they hate the team, hate the fans, hate Detroit, and are just evil as ****.

Maybe hitting instruction during a major league season is a little like navigating a ship in the ocean—the captain can turn it only a little a time, and not on a 180 standing in place. The coaching may have established a plan during spring of for Tork to take first pitches if they are not in his happy zone, and then think about looking primarily for pitches he can drive. But maybe now that it’s not working, it’s nearly impossible to change his entire approach on a dime right ****ing now, while he is facing flamethrowing big league pitching literally every single day. If coaching were to tell Tork, today, forget everything we told you this spring and simply change your approach immediately and swing at everything you think your bat can get to, not only is that going to call their entire coaching approach—one that is consistent with their organizational philosophy and that is working for other players on the team—into question, but it’s also going to butt up in his head against the instructions he got in spring that are still firmly in his mind, and create a confused mental state in which he is guessing and flailing on every pitch, instead of on mainly strike-two pitches. I’m not speaking as an apologist for the hitting coaches here, but simply to the difficulty of revamping an entire hitting approach which almost always either takes place at the big league level only during the offseason, or on an extended developmental trip to the minors, which Tork might well benefit from. The monkey wrench here is that we do not have a regular first baseman who can man the spot every day for several weeks while Tork is away completely remakin g his hitting approach, especially now the Canha is down. And just going out and acquiring the warmest body available and sticking that guy at first base every day at least until at the break is almost certainly not going to make Tigers fans any happier when they see the results. Go ahead and blame Harris if you like (and Hinch while yoou’re at it, because hell, why not) for not anticipating that Tork would completely stink up the joint and having a league-average starting first baseman just waiting around on the shelf to take over just in case, although I don’t think any team would have a contingency like that just ready to go. That’s a fan’s prerogative. But really, this looks like this is something Tork will just have to withstand for the next few weeks and try hard to figure out for himself at the major league level. This is definitely one of the hard parts of the game that every team goes through at some point.

OK, I quit, we suck. 😉

Fifth youngest team in the majors.

Maybe all the hitting coaches should be fired. Or maybe the hitting coaches are doing the right thing and Tork’s just too broken or even not good enough to execute the plan right.

Yeah, she’s a weasel, all right.

Tweet says it all.

I too have never voted Republican, although I did vote for Ed Clark for president in 1980 because he said he wanted to legalize weed.

Probably. A guy like that who lives at the far end of the forty is almost the textbook definition of fungible.

Plus Parker's crushing it in Toledo so he's probably earned another shot here.

gimme