tiger2022 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 It's not just the money but the team has to put an offense on the field that can win the world series. Skubal wants to pitch in the world series. Do you see the Tigers bringing in top tier free agents to bolster the offense? If you said yes, you are just lying to yourself. Skubal's comments about last season sure didn't sound like he had any confidence in Harris to do, quite frankly, anything other than bring in washed up guys that no one elae wanted to fill out the rotation. And this season he got hoodwinked by Valdez for a big contract for basically a below average starting pitcher. He's been hoodwinked by Alex Cobb, Flaherty, Verlander, Valdez, and Kenta Maeda. His track record for bringing in starting pitching is about as good as anyone on this message board's track record. His trades suck, his offensive free agents suck. Other than McGonigle, he has done absolutely nothing to help the major league roster. Quote
papalawrence Posted July 22 Posted July 22 When Kyle Tucker can get 60 mil/year, yeah, the Tigers aren't bringing in any top tier free agents. Valdez is about asking as I see them going Quote
Tiger337 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 51 minutes ago, tiger2022 said: It's not just the money but the team has to put an offense on the field that can win the world series. Skubal wants to pitch in the world series. Do you see the Tigers bringing in top tier free agents to bolster the offense? If you said yes, you are just lying to yourself. Skubal's comments about last season sure didn't sound like he had any confidence in Harris to do, quite frankly, anything other than bring in washed up guys that no one elae wanted to fill out the rotation. And this season he got hoodwinked by Valdez for a big contract for basically a below average starting pitcher. He's been hoodwinked by Alex Cobb, Flaherty, Verlander, Valdez, and Kenta Maeda. His track record for bringing in starting pitching is about as good as anyone on this message board's track record. His trades suck, his offensive free agents suck. Other than McGonigle, he has done absolutely nothing to help the major league roster. I remember when you said McGonigle was not ready. 2 Quote
tiger2022 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 (edited) 13 hours ago, Tiger337 said: I remember when you said McGonigle was not ready. And the point is? Harris hit on a 2nd round draft pick. So the point is some guy on the internet didn't think a 21 year old player would have an impact on a major league roster so all the awful moves Scott Harris has made are okay? Edited July 22 by tiger2022 Quote
1984Echoes Posted July 22 Posted July 22 (edited) Just my 2 cents... But... Acceptable trade packages for Skubal, if it comes to that: Brewers: Logan Henderson, Andrew Fischer, Bishop Letson. Dodgers: Emmett Sheehan Mike Sirota, Christian Zazueta. Braves: JR Ritchie, AJ Smith-Shawver, one of (I'm turning either one of these guys into our closer and dumping Jansen...) : Didier Fuentes or Spencer Strider. The key is to get these 3 teams to play/ bid off each other and maximize any return for Skubal. Also, each of these returns includes one guy who can step right into a starting rotation. Obviously none as good as Skubal is right now... but they do each have upside. Fischer (LH 1B/3B decent hit tool massive power (.292 BA .624 SP% in minors)), Letson (convert to closer at AAA) Sirota (RH OF very high hit very high OBP (.462 OBP in the minors) with above-average power (.585 SP% in minors)), Zazueta (convert to closer at AAA) And the Braves pitchers... I am looking for high end talent as well as filling Org weaknesses. Just my 2 cents. Edited July 22 by 1984Echoes Quote
1984Echoes Posted July 22 Posted July 22 21 minutes ago, LongLiveMaroth said: This is also an Athletic article by Ken Rosenthal: What we’re hearing about the Tigers’ likely asking price on Skubal and more trade deadline intel - The Athletic Quote
LongLiveMaroth Posted July 22 Posted July 22 16 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: Just my 2 cents... But... Acceptable trade packages for Skubal, if it comes to that: Brewers: Logan Henderson, Andrew Fischer, Bishop Letson. Dodgers: Emmett Sheehan Mike Sirota, Christian Zazueta. Braves: JR Ritchie, AJ Smith-Shawver, one of (I'm turning either one of these guys into our closer and dumping Jansen...) : Didier Fuentes or Spencer Strider. The key is to get these 3 teams to play/ bid off each other and maximize any return for Skubal. Also, each of these returns includes one guy who can step right into a starting rotation. Obviously none as good as Skubal is right now... but they do each have upside. Fischer (LH 1B/3B decent hit tool massive power (.292 BA .624 SP% in minors)), Letson (convert to closer at AAA) Sirota (RH OF very high hit very high OBP (.462 OBP in the minors) with above-average power (.585 SP% in minors)), Zazueta (convert to closer at AAA) And the Braves pitchers... I am looking for high end talent as well as filling Org weaknesses. Just my 2 cents. Man, you are going to be so let down by the return on Skubal if he gets traded. Here are what I would consider some more realistic trade packages for Skubal. Brewers: Adamczewski, Letson Dodgers: Hope, Ferris, maybe Harlan Braves: Smith-Shawver, Bauman Tampa: Hopkins, Forret Any of the above I would consider good-great offers for 1/2 a season of Skubal. I am definitely making the Dodgers pay more in this scenario but yeah I just want to temper expectations here because I already know everyone is going to be down on the return. Also Fischer has like 120K's between A+ and AA so not the control the strikezone type player that the Tigers covet. 3 1 Quote
Hongbit Posted July 22 Posted July 22 51 minutes ago, LongLiveMaroth said: Man, you are going to be so let down by the return on Skubal if he gets traded. Here are what I would consider some more realistic trade packages for Skubal. Brewers: Adamczewski, Letson Dodgers: Hope, Ferris, maybe Harlan Braves: Smith-Shawver, Bauman Tampa: Hopkins, Forret Any of the above I would consider good-great offers for 1/2 a season of Skubal. I am definitely making the Dodgers pay more in this scenario but yeah I just want to temper expectations here because I already know everyone is going to be down on the return. Also Fischer has like 120K's between A+ and AA so not the control the strikezone type player that the Tigers covet. I think you are going to be surprised at how much stronger the return will be. Teams will bid against each other and drive the price up. He’s a different level of player. There will be a few teams they weigh his ability to impact this year more than what a prospect could do in a few years. Quote
chasfh Posted July 22 Posted July 22 Nobody empties out the top of their farm system for deadline talent anymore, with the possible exception of Dave Dombrowski, who's also looking for starting pitching, although reportedly only back-end help. 1 Quote
monkeytargets39 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 I know how I feel about the Skubal situation and I know how all of you feel about my feelings on it so I won’t beat a dead horse. Unless this magical run happens and we blitz our way into the division lead and the playoffs, I think we need to do a lot of roster trimming between now and the start of 2027. Skubal more than likely is gone one way or another, and I would be open to the idea of re-signing Mize, Gleyber and Jake. All other pending free agents (Flaherty, Jansen, Verlander) can leave or be dealt. We are shedding a TON of payroll, so even giving Gleyber another deal like this years with maybe some incentives isn’t gonna hurt us and could really stabilize the offense if he can stay on the field. I’m not ready to anoint Lee or Anderson as an every day 2B yet—although Lee needs to stay in the picture. I don’t think we need to bring back any of Vierling, McKinstry, Outman, or Wenceel by just declining options or non offering arbitration. We’ve seen what they are, and it isn’t especially good. If Hinch is gonna Hinch, then make him do it with actual Major Leaguers. If we can hang onto Mize, Gleyber and Jake… you could potentially do this for a 13-man offense next year (assuming health) 1.) CF- Clark 2.) 2B/DH- Torres 3.) SS- McGonigle 4.) C- Dingler 5.) LF- Greene 6.) 1B- Torkelson 7.) RF/DH- Carpenter 8.) DH/3B- Keith 9.) 3B- Lee Bench: Rogers (C), Baez (UTIL), Meadows (OF), and one of Anderson/Peck/Cruz/Valencia for the last spot. In a perfect world (for me): We deal Skubal and can get a ready to go by opening day RH RF option (Mike Sirota preferably) and can use that last bench spot for Carpenter to PH/DH/Corner OF since he can’t ever seem to stay healthy and is prone to massive slumps, yet is still highly impactful. I think that can be a pretty versatile and productive lineup. I would really like that 1-3 to happen because that’s a group that’s going to be on base a lot and running up pitch counts and then you go into the 4-7 mashers, and then you still have competent hitters at the bottom. Plus the bench is defensively strong, pretty versatile, and work well as pinch runners. Productive without all of the soft underbelly of easy outs. Ideally we would’ve been able to do something like this most of this year. Pitching-wise I think if you can retain Mize for at least next year, a rotation of Melton/Mize/Jobe/Framber/? has a lot of upside and can be competitive. There’s a handful of decent upcoming FA options for the last rotation spot if we don’t fill it internally. I’d love for us to go get a tank like Sonny Gray (the type of guy I’d be fine with giving a nice payday to based off his health and performance in his career) I’ve really liked seeing Montero be the guy in the bullpen—and I’d like to see us try to do the same thing with Reese Olson and Jake Miller to emphasize their abilities while maybe putting less innings on their arms. Id like to see us restructure the bullpen a lot for next year and go: Middle relief: Holton, Hurter, Finnegan, Madden High leverage: Montero, Olson, Jake Miller, Free Agent. the group of Sommers/Waguespack/Burch Smith/DeJesus/Brieske/SGL/Horn/Vanasco/etc. can all be bullpen depth at Toledo if they’re brought back. Drop Will Vest and Anderson. Too inconsistent and will be too expensive for what they (don’t) give us at this point. Find one GOOD reliever who isn’t at the end of their career who can miss bats and DOESNT WALK A LOT OF GUYS. Raisel Iglesias still has great underlying metrics. Quote
Tiger337 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 1 minute ago, chasfh said: Nobody empties out the top of their farm system for deadline talent anymore, with the possible exception of Dave Dombrowski, who's also looking for starting pitching, although reportedly only back-end help. I believe you are right, but has their ever been a pitcher rental of Skubal's talent available at the deadline before? I am not expecting a big return, but I think his market is kind of an unknown. Still hoping for a 7-game winning streak right about now! 4 Quote
NorthWoods Posted July 22 Posted July 22 (edited) 3 hours ago, tiger2022 said: And the point is? Harris hit on a 2nd round draft pick. So the point is some guy on the internet didn't think a 21 year old player would have an impact on a major league roster so all the awful moves Scott Harris has made are okay? I think the point was that required foresight, not hindsight. Edited July 22 by NorthWoods 1 Quote
Tiger337 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 5 minutes ago, monkeytargets39 said: I’ve really liked seeing Montero be the guy in the bullpen—and I’d like to see us try to do the same thing with Reese Olson and Jake Miller to emphasize their abilities while maybe putting less innings on their arms. I am not sure pitching out of the bullpen will make pitchers healthier. It is fewer innings, but it is potentially more stressful innings and they don't have a strict routine like starters do. Quote
NorthWoods Posted July 22 Posted July 22 7 minutes ago, monkeytargets39 said: 2.) 2B/DH- Torres 6.) 1B- Torkelson Rogers (C), Meadows (OF) I think all four of these are gone with Rogers the most likely to stay. Tork and Gleyber because they can be replaced for less $$ and Meadows because no one can count on him and he's really never produced over an extended period. Quote
monkeytargets39 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 1 minute ago, Tiger337 said: I am not sure pitching out of the bullpen will make pitchers healthier. It is fewer innings, but it is potentially more stressful innings and they don't have a strict routine like starters do. I don’t think it will either—but with Reese and Miller missing extended time over the past year, it seems like an easier way to get them back into the big league roster and pitching instead of requiring them to build up stamina for high pitch counts. We could always stretch them back out if needed—but their actual stuff is better than what we currently have in the pen, so why not find a way to use it? I think we all expect Jobe to work out of the pen mostly when he returns…so same idea. Get them shorter outings to dial stuff in and establish confidence while still being vital to the team. 1 Quote
monkeytargets39 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 6 minutes ago, NorthWoods said: I think all four of these are gone with Rogers the most likely to stay. Tork and Gleyber because they can be replaced for less $$ and Meadows because no one can count on him and he's really never produced over an extended period. I’d be very surprised at this point if Tork and Meadows aren’t still in the org next year. They aren’t expensive, especially Meadows, and they do have a subset of things that they each do well. with Rogers—I’m sure you could go out there and find another backup catcher that works who might hit better, but Rog has a lot of history with the pitching staff and is still good defensively. He will be cheap to re-sign and seems like a good clubhouse veteran presence—so I think hanging onto him until the prospect catchers get closer to coming up makes sense. Torres will be expensive, but we have plenty of payroll room free and he has shown to have a major effect on the offense, so I can see it being considered. He’d be worth keeping around at least until Rainer is close and will push McGonigle out of SS. Maybe Peck does it first, but we will see. Quote
Edman85 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 You all know this, but good to see it getting some attention. https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2026/07/tigers-trade-rumors-tarik-skubal-luxury-tax-compensation-pick.html 2 Quote
monkeytargets39 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 16 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: I believe you are right, but has their ever been a pitcher rental of Skubal's talent available at the deadline before? I am not expecting a big return, but I think his market is kind of an unknown. Still hoping for a 7-game winning streak right about now! My thought is this— you have a couple franchises that haven’t won before (Milwaukee, Seattle and Tampa) who are on the cusp of being able to do it this year. If I’m a GM for one of those teams and I can bring in Skubal—I’m gonna aggressively try to do that. Misiorowski/Skubal would be devastating in a short playoff series, for example. Then you have to think that the Yankees and Dodgers who have HEAVILY invested already in winning now are going to recognize that and want to try and prevent that situation from happening. So everything is aligning for someone to overpay for Skubal. I get that we want to make a run at it too—but this could be a huge opportunity to bring in some top end talent with a ton of team control right at the same time as the Keith/McGonigle/Clark/Melton/Jobe/etc. core is starting to find their footing at this level. Quote
Hongbit Posted July 22 Posted July 22 26 minutes ago, chasfh said: Nobody empties out the top of their farm system for deadline talent anymore, with the possible exception of Dave Dombrowski, who's also looking for starting pitching, although reportedly only back-end help. There are no comps. He’s the ultimate anomaly. A pitcher of his caliber still in his prime coming off back to back Cy Young’s and sporting an ERA under 3. He’s the missing piece that all the contenders would love to have. I promise there will be someone that ups the ante way more than anyone is expecting right now. Quote
LongLiveMaroth Posted July 22 Posted July 22 47 minutes ago, Hongbit said: I think you are going to be surprised at how much stronger the return will be. Teams will bid against each other and drive the price up. He’s a different level of player. There will be a few teams they weigh his ability to impact this year more than what a prospect could do in a few years. I mean I hope you are right! I would always prefer to be surprised by a return versus disappointed in one, which is why I am tempering expectations. Quote
monkeytargets39 Posted July 22 Posted July 22 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Edman85 said: You all know this, but good to see it getting some attention. https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2026/07/tigers-trade-rumors-tarik-skubal-luxury-tax-compensation-pick.html It is pretty surprising how oblivious the Detroit media pundits are to this aspect of the situation. I brought it up to some radio host who posted a clip on TikTok saying the Tigers should just buy buy buy and release a bunch of players they don’t like at the deadline and it was like I was speaking Klingon to them. (And it wasn’t MCSonics) Edited July 22 by monkeytargets39 Quote
NorthWoods Posted July 22 Posted July 22 23 minutes ago, Edman85 said: You all know this, but good to see it getting some attention. https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2026/07/tigers-trade-rumors-tarik-skubal-luxury-tax-compensation-pick.html Sorry, I just dropped this in your thread.....didn't see it here 1st. Quote
1984Echoes Posted July 22 Posted July 22 2 hours ago, 1984Echoes said: ... Brewers: Logan Henderson, Andrew Fischer, Bishop Letson. Dodgers: Emmett Sheehan, Mike Sirota, Christian Zazueta. Braves: JR Ritchie, AJ Smith-Shawver, one of (I'm turning either one of these guys into our closer and dumping Jansen...) : Didier Fuentes or Spencer Strider. FYI: Fischer and Henderson are the 7th and 9th rated prospects in the Brewers system. Sirota & Zazueta are the 2nd and 8th rated prospects in the Dodgers system. The Braves pitchers are all in MLB... but I don't like their farm system and none of the guys I selected have yet turned into world-beaters. There is upside there, they all have talent... but that's the price they'll need to pay to get Skubal. IMO. Besides, it's not like I'm asking any of them to empty out the top of their farm system. Quote
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