Larkin wants out?

[gehringer_2]

51 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

Yes, this is a good point. Or at the very least, it is easy to imagine that Stevie has had several tough conversations with Dylan going back to his complaint about the lack of activity at the trade deadline, the year before last. Also, with the speculation that there have been tensions since the last contract negotiation, it is not hard to imagine that Stevie has been having tough conversations with Dylan about his leadership for several years.

you wonder what they expected. in the end he’s just a player. a guy doesn’t turn into combination of Winston Churchill and Clark Kent just because they put a  C. on his jersey. he sure can’t do anything about the talent. 

EDIT:to continue the thought - I wonder if Stevie remembers that when he was the captain of a winning team his coach was Scotty Frickin' Bowman, he had Shanahan ( a future league official and GM), Fetisov, a future league and political figure, Larianov, a future coach, and Linstrom. It wasn't like his teams needed him to be driving them solo over any finish lines. Those teams had leadership bursting at the seams.

Edited 2 hours ago by gehringer_2

[Hongbit]

I like the possibility of trading him to NJ for Hischier.   That’s a pretty even trade based on skill and Nico’s younger age.  The market demand would probably get them to throw in a semi decent prospect too.  

Larkin will definitely waive the NTC to get with Jack and then make a run at Quinn the next year.  Wings get a solid 1C that’s a few years younger than Larkin and will be super motivated in a new sweater after a pretty average year in 2025.

[Mr.TaterSalad]

I guess I am not fully opposed to trading Larkin for the right established player. But trading for a guy like Hischier or any established veteran just keeps this team in purgatory I feel like. We either need to get a #1 center, capable of putting up 90+ points in a season or we need to revamp this roster in the vein of Carolina, Florida, or Vegas and get tougher forecheckers and role out 3 lines of scoring. I don't see either of those two scenarios playing out anytime soon. As such, I would rather start the rebuild all over again, get draft capital, and have a shot at a #1 center or top-end talent now and in the future. This Larkin news has me in the camp of rebuilding the rebuild.

Edited 1 hour ago by Mr.TaterSalad

[buddha]

48 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

you wonder what they expected. in the end he’s just a player. a guy doesn’t turn into combination of Winston Churchill and Clark Kent just because they put a  C. on his jersey. he sure can’t do anything about the talent. 

EDIT:to continue the thought - I wonder if Stevie remembers that when he was the captain of a winning team his coach was Scotty Frickin' Bowman, he had Shanahan ( a future league official and GM), Fetisov, a future league and political figure, Larianov, a future coach, and Linstrom. It wasn't like his teams needed him to be driving them solo over any finish lines. Those teams had leadership bursting at the seams.

i dont think yzerman liked larkin taking a shot at the team last year for not adding.  leadership is taking it on yourself and not making excuses or blaming others.  and larkin's performance this year down the stretch was nothing to write home about.  HIS team failed two years in a row, and this year yzerman got him deadline help and he and the team still cratered.

i think the problems lay more with yzerman's team construction than larkin's play or leadership, but i can understand why yzerman wasnt entirely happy with larkin.

but this is the reponse?  leaking that you want out?  i suspect the team already knew.  bultman kind of alluded to that in the wwp pod today, that the league folks had an idea already.

the bottom line is that we dont know what happened behind the scenes and were all speculating.  

i still think there is a chance larkin doesnt go anywhere and he's playing in detroit next year.  probably a 25% chance.  if yzerman doesnt get what he thinks is value on the trade market or if larkin vetos a trade and holds out for minnesota (who doesnt have much detroit would really want), then its quite possible larkin is back in detroit.

at that point, whether he wants to be on the ice in detroit would be up to dylan larkin.

[gehringer_2]

1 minute ago, buddha said:

i dont think yzerman liked larkin taking a shot at the team last year for not adding.  leadership is taking it on yourself and not making excuses or blaming others.  and larkin's performance this year down the stretch was nothing to write home about.  HIS team failed two years in a row, and this year yzerman got him deadline help and he and the team still cratered

the thing that I've always wondered about in that episode is how much he was actually trying to take it on himself  - as Captain and all that - was he trying to speak to management for a sentiment that was percolating up from the team? That makes a big difference in how you might interpret that episode, and whether as 'Captain' Yzerman wants Larkin to be the company man in the clubhouse and maybe Larkin thought it was his job to represent for the players to management and management didn't like it. 

As you say, we don't know, but the 'obvious' explanations for things involving people and personalities are often not the right ones.

[Jason_R]

58 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

you wonder what they expected. in the end he’s just a player. a guy doesn’t turn into combination of Winston Churchill and Clark Kent just because they put a  C. on his jersey. he sure can’t do anything about the talent. 

EDIT:to continue the thought - I wonder if Stevie remembers that when he was the captain of a winning team his coach was Scotty Frickin' Bowman, he had Shanahan ( a future league official and GM), Fetisov, a future league and political figure, Larianov, a future coach, and Linstrom. It wasn't like his teams needed him to be driving them solo over any finish lines. Those teams had leadership bursting at the seams.

Of course Stevie remembers when Scotty Frickin’ Bowman was kicking the tires on a trade that would have sent Stevie to his hometown for Alexei Yashin. The details are similar:

The Wings, meanwhile, had begun to wonder if the 30-year-old Yzerman, despite his gaudy offensive numbers, would be able to lead them to the promised land. GM Scotty Bowman entertained the idea for a while, letting it known Yzerman was indeed available, much to Yzerman's chagrin.

…

It may have lit a fire under Yzerman, who played 11 more years in the NHL, becoming a more balanced player, a truly great leader, and a winner of three Stanley Cups.

https://kuklaskorner.com/abel-to-yzerman/reflecting-on-the-yzerman-for-yashin-trade-talk

Did Stevie remember this and buzz Larkin’s tower the way Scotty had done to him when he was the age Larkin is now?

[gehringer_2]

13 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

Did Stevie remember this and buzz Larkin’s tower the way Scotty had done to him when he was the age Larkin is now?

good point - sure could be. But OTOH, a possible difference in the story is that Larkin has always been the two-way player Yzerman had to be hit on the head to become. Not at the same talent level of course. So whatever Yzerman wants from Larkin (assuming that's the narrative) seems to be a different animal from what Bowman wanted from Yzerman.

and maybe it's just that Yzerman is a really hard headed cuss. The drive that made him a great player with his limited stature esp, is a rare one. Maybe (and I think probably) Larkin just isn't that guy. and can't be what Yzerman wishes he were. People are who they are. And this has already been said upthread in maybe a different way.

Edited 1 hour ago by gehringer_2

[Jason_R]

Lots of potential but who plays 1C?

[1984Echoes]

16 hours ago, lordstanley said:

I think you’re right, I was too negative. Perfect time to trade him, but I wish we had a stronger centre behind him. Those trade ideas are bone fide and intriguing but some I know will be non-starters, like the Leafs won’t trade the #1 for him. San Jose has youth and good contracts, what would we need to add to Larkin to get the #2 overall - Cossa? I’d do that. 

Plus... one of their young centers could get squeezed out if they added Larkin as their #2 center (Celebrini is NOT relinquishing his #1 spot...). They also have Will Smith who would end up as their #3 center...

How about Larkin plus any of our goalies for Michael Misa and the #2?

[1984Echoes]

1 hour ago, Hongbit said:

I like the possibility of trading him to NJ for Hischier.   That’s a pretty even trade based on skill and Nico’s younger age.  The market demand would probably get them to throw in a semi decent prospect too. ...

I would think the same thing with Robert Thomas and Elias Peterson too.

If I had a choice, Robert Thomas would be #1 on that list (center for center). 

[Hongbit]

Just now, 1984Echoes said:

I would think the same thing with Robert Thomas and Elias Peterson too.

If I had a choice, Robert Thomas would be #1 on that list (center for center). 

I don’t see any way that Larkin goes to Vancouver.   I doubt that he’s accept St. Louis either.  He’s going to want a team that is playoff ready or close enough and has some of his buddies on it.