1984Echoes

I think if they spend big money, it's on a CB. The good ones (meaning capable of playing the position and not getting burned for TD's...) are just too rare. I think it's easier to manufacture a pass-rush. In multiple different ways: a good DE, a pass-rushing interior player, a blitz-LB'er, or good-blitzing Safeties or CB's... I just think there are too many ways to bandaid a D-Line or a pass-rush. You can't bandaid a Burnt-Toast-CB so if they spend money, IMO... it's here.

This is misinformation. Reports were they were hot on Devon Witherspoon, a CB, at their #6 spot. When he got selected ahead of them, they traded down.

Speaking specifically about Frazier: He's also a Center. So they'll value him as a talent fit for what the Lions need: Someone who can step in at Guard but also cover Ragnow, if needed. And I think the Lions definitely need that kind of player, regardless what they do with Glasgow and Jonah. But if the following players all pass the culture fit test, and all the CB's are given "1st round grades" versus Frazier is evaluated as a "2nd round grade", then they'll select the CB: Rakestraw/ Arnold/ Mitchell/ DeJean. If Rakestraw & TJ Tampa are given middle-2nd round grades by the Lions (just for example) and Frazier a top of the 2nd round grade, they would pick Frazier. But I'm going to go back to that culture fit part... That ALSO weighs heavily not just as a pass-fail, but also as to the "round grade" of a player. If a player "is a BEAST" or "Excellent Culture Leader", I think that also boosts or degrades a players "round value". Rakestraw could be a "high 2nd" round value in terms of talent to the Lions, and Frazier might be a mid-2nd" in terms of talent... but if Frazier is a "BEAST" in the running game and an exceptional leader in the locker room and on the field... they might OVERRULE the "Talent" factor of Rakestraw and boost Frazier to "end-of-1st" value whilst keeping Rakestraw as a "2nd round" guy. I'm just sayin.... You can't just say "higher talent" or "BPA" or "need" with the Lions. IMO. Holmes and DC have a lot of nuances imbedded into their rankings and I don't think any of us can just simplify it into a BPA vs. Need or "higher talent" quip. These dudes are complicated in certain (winning... love it) ways.

The first bolded part is not correct. You guys are confused. The second bolded part is what these guys keep saying, over and over and over... It's not the highest talent, or RAS, or "graded" player. It's not "oh we like this guard because he's a Lion even though this CB is also a Lion..." They rank positional value/ talent/ Lions' characteristics equally... BUT: missing Lions culture fit and they're off the board. Culture fit is a "MUST HAVE". But once you get past that culture fit... then they DO rank positional value and talent. There is also some maneuvering based on where a player is most likely to get drafted, or also known as "round grade". They had ranked Gibbs and Campbell as 1st round talents (on the Lions board; they'll have positions ranked based on their schemes, not on the rest of the NFL...). But above them both was Devon Witherspoon. They just lost their chance at Witherspoon to a team drafting ahead of them so they traded down, instead. I remember them saying specifically after the draft last year that they only had a "few" players "with a 1st round grade". So most players probably failed the culture fit test, no matter the talent. And I don't know/(remember) if they had a 1st round grade on LaPorta, but they were definitely "hot" to go after him. They traded up to get Branch. They probably also had only a few players with a 2nd round grade (fit for the Lions) and wanted him enough to trade up for him. But they traded BACK from the 2nd round, believing that Hooker would fall to the 3rd and they could get him there (buddha was correct on that), meaning they felt Hooker had a "3rd round grade" or would likely fall to there.

Like a kicker?

The only flipside to this is: Trump is such an existential threat to our Democracy that you wouldn't actually be voting for Biden if you "pulled the lever" for him. You would be voting for The Constitution of the United States and The American Way of Life. You would be voting for country, over party. Just my 2 cents.

Only as a splinter group. Like this: Except: The only one ****ting his pants if Haley ran as an Independent would be Trump. Biden would not be affected. Except that he'd now win in a blowout, both vote-wise and EC-wise.

In dribs and drabs it is... But not enough yet to drive the point home...

Radio/ Billboards/ Fox News (yes, blare it out loud): "REPUBLICANS! If you want to DEFEAT MAGA, VOTE DEMS ONLY!!!"

There's always another choice... I have a good one for all the people you know: Siberia.

PS: Rumor mill is that Steve is willing to trade a defenseman but... only if it results in an upgraded defenseman in return... Not certain how that would work out for us...

Yeah, they might again be proving that they are not yet ready to play against the big boys... But I'd like to see them get in the playoffs, even so...

I hope that means Sasser is back and ready to play...

Is anyone watching Shogun? It's ****ing brilliant and has one of my favorite actors of all time: Hiroyuki Sanada.

This might have been some of what I was thinking/ hearing...: https://www.prideofdetroit.com/2023/6/3/23747714/2023-detroit-lions-draft-recap-podcast-brodric-martin-profile-scouting-report-explosiveness-wku

I'm pretty certain the team has said Martin is athletic or has "sneaky athleticism" or along similar lines... so I have no idea what they mean by that... especially looking at that RAS... Or maybe it was something about "very impressive strength"...?

He doesn't tackle well. Holmes & DC will hate him. He won't be on their board AT ALL. Neither will "Kool-Aid". Just as an FYI. They like CB's who aren't afraid to tackle. DC and Glenn and Holmes have all said hard-nosed tackling is way high for them for a CB... That means the top of their CB list = Terrion Arnold ("aggressive tackler, works through blockers and gets after it as a tackler"), Quin Mitchell ("tackles like a safety, ball skills of a CB; hounds routes; physicality at catch point; tackles in run support and wraps up"), Ennis Rakestraw ("hard-nosed in press coverage/ good physicality/ rough ride for receivers when he jams; salty in run support with willingness to wrap, lift, and drop ball-carriers; drives hard/ well-timed punches"), Cooper DeJean ("charges hard and slams into pass-catchers; limited length = he slips off of some runners/ tackles; nice physicality"), TJ Tampa (more of a 2nd/3rd round type CB): ("physical as a striker, in coverage, and in run support, forceful route redirection when pressing"). Not Wiggins ("needs to become a tougher player in run support or when contesting catches against NFL size; allows too much cushion; disappointing awareness & effort in run support"), or McKinstry ("struggles against physical route-runners; content to stay in the background as a run defender; bad habit of sleeping on the play when he is not directly targeted").

Martin was in deep-dive training this past season. The team has HUGE belief in him (from their limited comments I've seen...) Raw as hell so they were in intense fundamentals/ technique training the whole year. The team believes his size/ power/ athleticism is off the charts... but with badly raw technique from his lower division school... I'll guess we'll find out this coming year (is my guess) what the team actually sees in him... And whether all that fundamentals training will have some kind of affect...

I think I spotted a Maxx Crosby in this year's draft... we'll see if he can find his way to the Lions...

👍👍

I'd want him on a Larkin-Raymond line. For keeps. But yeah... beyond doubtful this would happen...

Says YOU. It ABSOLUTELY is relevant.

For 25 years the Palestinians were perfectly fine with letting in Jews and selling land to Jews (roughly 1897-1921 or so...) And... THEN... They realized, just like the Mexicans (in Texas) around 1840 or so that... "WHOOPS!!!", maybe they were making a mistake...

They must really like Cossa and Edvinsson and Danielson and ASP and some of our other secondary prospects... Heck.. there's still Kasper and Augustine and Wallinder (if they like him) and Mazur... And...

Oh PLEASE let's not turn this thread topic into another referendum on religious belief. I thought we had an ACTUAL thread for that if you want to start up that argument again? Otherwise, it's just unnecessary and NOT-appreciated POLLUTION in this thread.