Mr.TaterSalad

It isn't about them being stupid as much as it is desperation. GMs do desperate things all the time, especially for a QB, to try to improve their franchise and save their own asses. Look at what Ryan Pace did trading up to get Justin Fields. He mortgaged the Bears and his own future just to get a QB. The Chargers that year had Easton Stick and Tyrod Taylor signed at the QB position that year once they let Philip Rivers go. If the Lions had drafted Herbert and the Dolphins Tua, where were the Chargers going to find their starter at? Not in free agency, because all the halfway decent guys were signed by then. I'm not continuing this topic after this but I firmly believe that Bob Quinn failed in his responsibility to gin up the necessary belief in other teams minds that he was taking a QB. Brad Holmes' comments from the other day signal an all options on the table approach, which is the right message to send IMO. Bob Quinn's message at the time seemed to cement that the Lions weren't drafting a QB, period. San Diego had no need to worry because they'd get either Tua or Herbert because they knew the Lions weren't taking a QB and were hanging onto Stafford.

The logic to trade back isn't hey Miami, it's hey San Diego. And you also don't have to move on from Stafford in year one, you can sit the rookie behind him to dilute the QB market for 2020 and then trade him in the 2021 offseason. I think if you wanted to trade back in 2020 San Diego, not Miami, was your best trading partner. I think the logic was hey San Diego, you and about 2-3 other teams (Miami, Philly) are in the market for and desperate need of a QB. You've got both us and Miami ahead of you who could pick a QB. We know you wanted one of Tua or Herbert, but now you won't get either because we're about to draft one of the two. We are also hanging onto Stafford and will let the rookie sit behind him for a year, so that further dilutes the market of quality staters for you. So unless someone gives us a really great offer for Stafford, he's wearing a Lions uniform next year. However, we are equally interested in trading back to your draft spot, as much as we are in taking a QB at #3. If you trade back with us it gives you the chance to pick your QB ahead of Miami and stops us from taking your guy. If you don't trade back you're not getting Tua, Herbert or Stafford. You are going to be stuck drafting the third QB on your board or desperately looking elsewhere for your stater. Who knows how San Diego valued Jalen Hurts. But based on where Hurts was drafted, it couldn't have been a first round grade. Quinn screwed up because both San Diego and Miami knew he was never seriously going to take a QB. He gave them no incentive to trade with him. I think Holmes is being smart here because he's signalling to teams that all options are on the table, including drafting a QB. Who would San Diego have put out as their starter if Quinn had taken Herbert and the Dolphins Tua? Quinn needed to either call their bluff by drafting a QB or threaten to pull the trigger to get them to move up. Teams have multiple plans for draft night, Quinn could have signaled to San Diego he was equally interested in taking a QB or trading back and it was up to them what he did. If they wanted to let the Lions trade back then they would get their guy. If not, they'd be stuck scrambling elsewhere to find a starter. Good luck with Tyrod Taylor starting in week one.

You're assuming they value Goff as or more highly than they would a rookie QB. They wouldn't just call his bluff to call it if they don't value Goff.

No one believes Arizona will take a QB because they are locked into Murray and everyone knows that. The Lions aren't locked into Goff in the same way the Cardinals are with Murray. I do believe that GMs out there do speculate on who might be ranked where on another team's draft board, especially when it comes to top ten picks. So there could be a team, or multiple, that think the Lions have Anthony Richardson or Will Levis ranked high on their board, but not as their #1 or #2 guy. I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility that a team trades with the Lions to ensure they get their guy (Richardson or Levis) and the Lions don't take him. Example, if a team like the Titans was hell bent on getting a new QB, and they really liked Richardson or Levis, yet they thought the Lions might snag one of them because of the way Brad Holmes acted, I don't think it's unrealistic to think they'd trade with us to get their guy. If I'm wrong about the mindset of other GMs and this then so be it.

So you believe that GM chatter and what they say regarding drafting a QB matters when it comes to trading to get ahead of you but not in trading with you to move back. I wonder what Miami or San Diego would have done if Quinn had played his hand smarter, much less if he called their bluff and drafted Herbert or Tua.

Quinn absolutely F'ED that off-season up by basically declaring we weren't drafting a QB. As you said, he potentially had the option to get someone to leap frog the Lions and push Chase Young into their lap. So that to me signals that other teams do care about and pay attention to what other GMs say and how they act. I don't buy into the idea that what a GM says or how they portray their strategy doesn't impact another team's and front offices decisions.

I think GMs look at a position as valuable as QB and go "We'll do whatever it takes to get our guy." If they so much as think someone is a threat to drafting their guy they'll be willing to move up and get him, including trading with us in this instance. If this isn't the case then why doesn't Holmes just come out and say publicly that we aren't drafting a QB?

This is beautiful. I love everything Holmes is saying about drafting a QB. Unlike that dope prior to him, Bob Quinn, who basically announced to the world he wasn't drafting Tua or Herbert, Holmes is playing it up like we could draft a QB. The more Holmes gins up the QB talk and gets teams wondering what he's doing I think the better our chances are to get both a trading partner and a good deal when moving back. Bob Quinn on the other hand had a flashing neon sign saying "WE AREN'T DRAFTING A QB!" and thus had no chance to move out of the third spot. Great work Brad. I don't actually want them to use a high round pick on a QB and I don't think they will. But Holmes playing this up is smart business.

This could be one of the reasons they cleared cap space for . . . Campbell is 35 and likely only has a year or so left to play. Campbell was still fairly productive last year recording 5.5 sacks and 36 tackles.

@Biff Mayhem if you're into Sci-Fi films and don't mind low budget movies check out The McPherson Tape. It is, if not the very first, one of the first found footage films of all time. Pretty basic plot line about an alien abduction and the entire movie is shot using a camcorder. There is a 1990's remake, but for sure watch the original 1989 film first.

Yeah, I shared it there for sure as well and I think also when we switched over to the new board too. I first saw it sometime around 2019ish. I had to give it a re-watch once or twice to get all of the small details and plot twists I initially missed. Following which character is which and where they belong took a lot of mental stimulation haha. This movie definitely makes you think a bit.

If you are a Sci-Fi fan do yourself a favor and watch the movie Coherence from 2013. It is super low-budget and the entire movie was shot in the Director's home and neighborhood. But man, what a great plot line and twist it has. It is a very unique sci-fi plot and if you can get past the low budget and accept the acting for what it is, I think you'll really enjoy it. Trailer: Full Movie: https://tubitv.com/movies/524652/coherence

Would you draft Calijah Kancey at #6?

So if Lamar gets traded to the Colts, I would assume the Ravens get the #4 overall pick. I would also assume the Anthony Richardson would be there and would be Baltimore's pick. Trading one QB who had accuracy and throwing concerns coming into the league for another is bit ironic.

If the Lions were trading for a WR would you rather Courtland Sutton or DeAndre Hopkins?

Damn! Oh well, time to address Linebacker in the draft.

My guess as to Chark's logic is that he'll get to be the #1 WR now in Carolina and not be the third guy on the roster. He'll get more target share and thus more opportunity to showcase himself. He knows Detroit already has their top two WRs for the foreseeable future and Carolina doesn't. So he can showcase himself more there and possibly get a long term deal from them to be their top guy.

I would take one of the Corners before Skoronski too. Gonzalez being my first choice. It's just that I don't believe Dave Birkett is way off base with his take that they could take him at #6. Especially if they believe he is capable of being a Tackle too or if they view him along the lines of a Quenton Nelson type of a Guard. The Lions and this regime values really good offensive lineman and players who give them versatility. Skoronski could give them both.

Would you take someone who could be a starting Tackle at #6? If so, I think Skoronski is in that group with Paris Johnson Jr. as a high end Tackle prospect and will get top 10 consideration, potentially at #6.

They might look at him as a Guard for now and then transition him over to Tackle to replace Taylor Decker after this season. I'm not saying I'd pick Skoronski, but I wouldn't write him off as being an option at #6.

That's why I think Quetin Johnston is on their draft board. I don't know that they'll value him at #6 but in a trade back scenario or moving up from #18, I could see the team valuing him.

Damn, HBO is doing a Jason Isbell documentary. That wasn't something I had on my radar for 2023. Really excited to watch this when it comes out.

I think he's completely off their draft board. Beyond his legal troubles, I think him showing up to the combine out of shape and looking lazy during drills soured them. Short of something crazy like him being there in the 3rd round or later, they aren't drafting him period.

I think with Chark gone this increases the chances that they take a guy like Quetin Johnston from TCU in the first round. Johnston is the kind of tall, big-bodied, contested catch receiver that they need in lieu of losing Chark.

The fact that they aren't spending $5-$6-$7+ million on a backup QB does actually give me hope that they are planning to make a splash move here in the near future.