HeyAbbott

I am 99% in line with the guys you have leaving. The one exception is Miggy, and I want him gone immediately. With the position players we have, Haase, Greene, Tork, and Carpenter are probably what I look to build around. With everything else, if another and better option can be found, take it. I am leaning toward keeping Schoop and replacing Candy. My gut says we aren't going to get an average mlb performance from Candy in '23.

While I tend to agree with this in principle, I think that there are required changes to make this team better. We have a team that has been mired in sub mediocrity for rapidly almost a decade. Are there any changes that we can agree upon that need to be made? Reading through this thread, one could almost think that we have been talking about a 90 win team.

https://www.freep.com/story/sports/mlb/tigers/2022/10/25/detroit-tigers-hire-rob-metzler-tampa-bay-rays-scott-harris/69589372007/ Tigers hire Rob Metzler as assistant GM.

Absolutely agree

So far my wish list of changes has taken place, Coolbaugh is gone. Chadd is gone. Kevin Rand is gone. The next thing for me is to learn how Harris will define "calculated risk".

Excellent points.

I think this discussion on Candy does depend upon how one evaluates, or, more precisely, how one perceives risk. It looks like, after having given 2022 AL regular season stats a quick glance, it will take a .700 team OPS to be in contention for a playoff spot. To have a Tigers team OPS of .700 or over as of today is not likely at all for the 2023 season as currently constructed. There should be steps to move toward that objective though. I am not convinced that Candy or any currently known replacement fulfills that need. I think that he isn't worth 7 million based on performance. Do you bet with Candy and keep him, or do you bet against him and cut ties with him? I cut ties in some fashion and gamble on someone else.I will spend that money and every dime coming off the payroll this year plus more if I were running the show.

Granted I am very jaded at this juncture. I also think it is possible to field an improved team as the organization is rebuilt. With a quality catcher added from FA, a reasonable SS and an additional RH OF the team would be at least entertaining. I cannot tolerate another 100 ABS of Willie Castro though. And I certainly cannot watch a team that is literally the worst offensive pro baseball that Detroit has seen in the last century. There just comes a point where there needs to be some minimal expectations from this team. I expect a team to have a .700 OPS which in 2022 would have made it number 15, smack dab in the middle of all of MLB. I expect average defense. I am very weary of hearing the endless excuses for why we can't even aspire to mediocrity, let alone excellence.

Realistically, we have maybe 3 position players that would find a position on any other existing MLB team. We are 6 to 8 position players shy from being a true MLB team. We are 3 starting pitchers short of being reliably mediocre. Forty percent of the 40 man is worthless cannon fodder. 2023 is a lost cause as is 2024 is most likely. We should be able to find 2 or 3 players that will contribute long term.

This sounds like what the Harris approach might be. I have said my piece on this and I hereby impose a muzzle rule on myself about Miggy being on the team in 2023. No more on this subject for me.

There is enough rot on this team offensively that Miggy had limited impact on offensive performance. That is not the point in my view. Either an organization conveys to its members and stakeholders it is committed to excellence or it doesn't. The Tigers are in the latter category. It has roughly 40 percent of its 40 man roster that needs to be gone regardless of what they do with Miggy. They need a 3B, an SS and an outfielder, with the outfielder being the easiest to get. I do believe very strongly that Miggy's mere presence is a problem. I also know whatever I think about that has less value than a half pint of cold spit. He will be on the team. The minimum offensive goal should be a team OPS of .700. As for Jake Rogers, I assume he will be "Just A Guy" at best next year.

I know we've beat this dead horse into maggot chow, but, the continued presence of Miggy on the team is a detriment to the progress and goal congruence of the whole organization. If I were running things, I'd give him a choice between his immediate release, an assistant coach position, or a rehab assignment with the Lakeland Flying Tigers. It needs to be made clear to this organization from top to bottom, and in every niche, corner, and crevice that improved results are the number one goal. There are no exceptions to that now and ever again. Other than this, I'd find a way to put him on the IL to the end of his contract. I never want to see him on the field as a player ever again.

It will be interesting to see what Harris really means by "calculated risk". It is time for some bold moves, especially on the 40 man. I have grown tired with the 20 plus years of pissing and moaning about the dimensions of the park. Put in a new wall that makes the longest distance at 405 feet. Pull in RF by 15 feet. Get it done. This fixation on the park's size has hurt the organization's planning for far too long. As for the roster, do whatever you can to make it better. With position players, the keepers are Haase, Baez, Greene, Carpenter, and Tork (in Toledo only). Throw in one of the Castro's for the super sub. We have to keep Schoop, but a replacement for Candy must be found. If not, replace Schoop and eat a contract. I do not care in the slightest what happens to the rest of the position players, including Miggy. I know some will have to be kept. I am far more interested in those Harris will not keep. As for the pitching, well for me, that is for another post

HEAR! HEAR! Gentlemen, I give you the right honorable gentleman Casimir!!!

Here is hoping that there are meaningful changes in the days ahead.

It's a wrap.

Watching this season coming to an end is like going into surgery for a nagging back or joint problem. Current and recent moments have been painful, but at least there is a promise of less pain in the days ahead.

From a roster standpoint, it is time for Miggy to go.

I don't understand how it would do the team more harm to the club to cut Miggy for 2023. I suspect that it might not go over well with the Latin players, and that would be my only reason for keeping him around. It is time to move past the Miggy era right now. If he is going to stick around, make him the 2nd assistant hitting coach or something, but I don't want him on the active roster.

This seems like a reasonable plan.

We have a 40 man roster, where 12 to 16 probably should be gone. I could live with the above plan because I think the minimum is we need a new 3B, a different SS/ 2B and a new LF for '23. I still want to see the pile of bodies trimmed from the 40 mam roster at the end of the day as well.

If I were Harris, I'd be looking for a new OF. a SS, and a 3B as suggested earlier. I would also be getting rid of the dead wood on the 40 man. Maybe all of the pruning need not take place immediately, but expeditiously.

What seems most reasonable at this point would be for Harris to totally revamp the scouting department first. I think that Chadd is gone, as well as others. I see a lot of attention given to bio-mechanics in the organization going forward. I see a major change on the 40 man roster. Hinch and his staff are safe.

This team, both on the active roster, and in the farm system has a lot of dead wood. This team is kind of a fixer-upper house right now. The most important thing is to get rid of the copious amounts of dead wood throughout the organization. After that is cleared away, there will be a more clear picture of where the team is at. I am of the opinion that the pitching situation can be pruned around the edges, but there are too many rehab and injured pitchers to do much. I am more inclined to be aggressive on the position player side of the equation. While it may not to be clear what all of the moves should be, some of them are clear.

They're actually fun to listen to tonight.