mtutiger

Fred Upton is the name most floated in this instance... although he lobbed a bomb at McCarthy on cable news, so that probably won't happen

Both this thread and just the general actions of McCarthy heading into the votes suggest just a complete misestimation of his Dem colleagues all around, both during the lead up to the possible shutdown, the aftermath and now this vote. It's like they tried to set traps with the shutdown that didn't really materialize (with exception of maaaybe the fire alarm thing, but even that is questionable)... and then they rolled into yesterday and just assumed they'd get a few people to vote or take a walk without putting in any work at all. And it just backfired on all fronts. Going out on a limb here, but outside of being a prodigious fundraiser, McCarthy otherwise seems like a really untalented politician... and it has showed.

This is a really interesting thread giving the Dem perspective on this, and even sheds some light that I hadn't even considered.

What the knuckleheads don't understand* as well is that a Kevin McCarthy who survived on Democratic votes would have only hastened his demise as Speaker as well over the long term. It's just very strange** that all these cynical politicos are conveniently deciding to pretend we live in Sorkin-land when they all know how this game works. *they understand but are arguing in bad faith **it's not strange, they are again arguing in bad faith

Also love the folks who act like that's a consequence-free vote for Democrats pols... particularly for the vulnerable ones that MyKev would spend millions working to defeat in 2024.

Again, *this* is the guy that many feel Dems had to save today... It's not like we're talking about John Boehner or even Paul Ryan.... *this* guy

*something something* institutional norms *something something*

I'm a little surprised, but there are too many hard nos in his caucus... when no Dems offered to help for free, and with him refusing to offer anything in terms of concessions to Dems, the writing was on the wall

I still haven't heard a good explanation on this one

Uh huh... And who bears some responsibility in that exactly? Who has spent years nurturing and enabling thus behavior?

Tom Cole sticking the responsibility for failed Republican governance on *checks notes* Democrats lol

To me, it was a really bad sign when the games where CMo, Todd Jones and Petry covered the games without a PBP announcer ended up more entertaining than a typical broadcast. With a better PBP announcer, that wouldn't be the case....

To be honest, the only people thus far who seem hung up on the dollars are the ones saying everyone else thinks so and so costs too much. I dont view free agency in terms of them spending dollars to hit a certain threshold... they could sign someone for the league minimum or $30 mil/year, that doesn't matter to me. I just want them to make good moves that make sense with where they are at. Particularly with this position player crop, there aren't a ton of great options that make a ton of sense... starting pitching is another matter entirely, there's a lot of good money to be burned there if they want to. And I'd be fine with that if the opportunity arose.

It's also a completely legitimate viewpoint, fwiw.

Speaking of strawmen....

I would like to see Greg Gania get the job if he wants it.... he's ML quality and some other org will end up with him eventually one imagines.

Well, who else are you referring to then?

Right, and then when I point out a name that I threw out, who was doing the "scolding" exactly?

Mark Canha had a 2.2 WAR this year. Joc had a 0.6 WAR. And he was about equivalent to, if not better, than Joc in just about every offensive category.

I assume I'm one of the "scolds" you are referring to and I threw out Mark Canha's name yesterday.

Give me a ****ing break

I don't even think they would have to go that far - just going the Fred Upton route (ie. moderate GOP member / caretaker Speaker) would probably be workable. My thing is that, though some GOP strategists in my Twitter feed seem to think it's the Democratic Caucus's job to clean this situation up, in reality, this is sort of the GOP's mess and it's not clear the degree to which the Dems have a role to play in fixing it at this point.

Which gets back to the point that, despite the GOP holding a majority, we do not even know if anyone can even get a majority of that caucus in the first place. It's sort of similar to the initial Speaker votes that happened, I'm not really sure there's much of a role for Dems at this point other than to give nothing away for free and make the GOP figure this thing out.... whether it be through finding someone internally who they can all agree on or whether it's through the Don Bacon types growing a spine and finding someone they can all work with.