1/4/26 2:00PM Pistons @ Cavs

[Tigeraholic1]

Rocket Arena - Cleveland, OH

 

[Deleterious]

 

[Deleterious]

Knicks are about to lose their 2nd in a row.  

[Deleterious]

 

[Deleterious]

 

[buddha]

i really like duren, but the more i watch the less comfortable i am paying him $30m this summer.  

the argument for doing that is that he is getting better every year and is young enough that you can anticipate more growth.  perhaps a reliable jump shot emerges that turns him into a decent floor spacer?

the argument against is that he's a more athletic andre drummond.  when cade is out, duren cannot carry the team.  in fact, he often looks useless without cade throwing him lobs.  maybe that's on the pistons for not finding a comparable second ball handler/distributor, but it also shows duren is not a bona fide #2 scorer all teams need next to their superstar.  if you pay duren (and then have to pay ausar), you've now trapped yourself with cade and two non-shooting, non-scorers as your robins to his batman.  i dont think you can win with that.

but if they DONT pay duren, then what do they do?

[buddha]

im gping to change my mind on this ten more times over the next year.

[casimir]

8 minutes ago, buddha said:

im gping to change my mind on this ten more times over the next year.

Right there with you.  There are less lobs now than there were earlier this season, teams have picked up on that.  There seems to be a little bit more post game than just out backs this season, but it’s purely in the paint.  As you say, he needs to extend out a bit.  If he can show a nominal jumper, that gives him more room to dribble drive by slower bigs, which I think he still has a quickness advantage there more days than not.

[Deleterious]

Ultimately, we need to see how he does in the playoffs before deciding.  We learned that from Beasley last year.  He was great in the regular season.  But in the playoffs he did what he always does in the playoffs, he **** the bed.   

The Pistons are in a good spot from a negotiation standpoint.  They can tell Duren, here is our 4/$100 million offer, go see if you can get better. 

Teams are reluctant to sign restricted free agents to offer sheets because it ties that money up for 3 days while the original team decides if they will match or not.  So other free agents are coming off the board as their money is tied up in a player they might not land.  The risk in landing nobody is pretty high that way.

 

[gehringer_2]

3 hours ago, buddha said:

the argument against is that he's a more athletic andre drummond.

I would say this is a bit of an unfair comparison though because from every indication, including his own admissions in recent years, Andre was not interested in being a better player when he still had the chance to be. I don't follow the pistons anything like some of you guys do but has anybody ever accused Duren of not working hard on his game?

[Deleterious]

Both player's 4th year stats.  Ignore Drummond's 3PT% since he only took 6 attempts that year.

Something else to factor in.  Andre had Reggie Jackson where Duren  has Cade.  Ironically, both had Tobias.  

[Deleterious]

Knicks about to lose their 3rd in a row.  

[gehringer_2]

1 hour ago, Deleterious said:

Both player's 4th year stats.  Ignore Drummond's 3PT% since he only took 6 attempts that year.

Something else to factor in.  Andre had Reggie Jackson where Duren  has Cade.  Ironically, both had Tobias.  

so over 81 games Duren project to 2.6 VORP?

Andre could rebound, you can't fault him on that.

[buddha]

andre was fine as a player, but he decided he was going to be the focal point of the offense which is he was quite unqualified to be.  its not his fault the pistons paid him so much money, it is his fault that he demanded to be a bigger part of the offense than he had any right to have.

and the team let him do it and he became disruptive to the point of being detrimental.

he was a great rebounder.  if he had decided to be just that - and a rim runner - he could have been a very good player.  instead  he will be remembered largely as a clown.

a very well paid clown.

[gehringer_2]

15 minutes ago, buddha said:

andre was fine as a player, but he decided he was going to be the focal point of the offense which is he was quite unqualified to be.  its not his fault the pistons paid him so much money, it is his fault that he demanded to be a bigger part of the offense than he had any right to have.

and the team let him do it and he became disruptive to the point of being detrimental.

he was a great rebounder.  if he had decided to be just that - and a rim runner - he could have been a very good player.  instead  he will be remembered largely as a clown.

a very well paid clown.

Don't forget that Andre's other big problem was he was just intimidated by other big guys who put a body on him. Who can forget Embiid getting in his head? I think any player out there would think twice before trying that on Duren.

[1984Echoes]

5 hours ago, buddha said:

i really like duren, but the more ...

but if they DONT pay duren, then what do they do?

I believe he's an RFA... right?

Which means... they don't have to max him.

They can tell him "go out and check your market..."

I don't know if anyone would offer him because they know we'd just match. But if he did get an offer, I don't think it's $30 mill per. His market will be much lower than that because other teams can obviously see the same shortcomings you've outlined...

The short story is... maybe he costs less than we think. Not a max player. But I don't know what those numbers/ years would be. Or if it could be structured advantageously...?

NBA contracts = I know nothing.

[Deleterious]

1 hour ago, gehringer_2 said:

so over 81 games Duren project to 2.6 VORP?

Andre could rebound, you can't fault him on that.

Not sure.  Not a big box score metric guy, so I don't really know how VORP works.  He was at 2.7 last year so you are probably correct.  

[Deleterious]

We need to get the Pistons over to Cass Tech for a geometry class.  The four off ball guys just stand there.  Move, create better passing angles to get the ball.  Is Phil Jackson still alive?

[Deleterious]

 

[Sports_Freak]

Has anyone heard where Blaha has been?

[Deleterious]

2 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said:

Has anyone heard where Blaha has been?

Last game, Greg said he was on vacation.  I'm guessing for the holidays.  They had 6 games out of 7 that were on the road, he probably didn't want to travel.  I bet he is back tomorrow against the Knicks at home.

[Deleterious]

I wonder which organization Donovan Mitchell will disappoint next.  

[Deleterious]

Stew just locked down Mitchell and blocked his weak shot attempt.  

[Deleterious]

Ouch.  Bad foul by Stew

[Deleterious]

2 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

Stew just locked down Mitchell and blocked his weak shot attempt.  

It doesn't get any better than that.