Larkin wants out?

[buddha]

minny: wellstedt, yurov, and stramel for larkin and cossa.

carolina: nikishin and a first rounder.

florida: #9, loustarinen, vilmanis

tampa" o'reilly and geekie

stars: hardy

utah: iginla, barrett hayton, first round pick.

🤢🤮

[gehringer_2]

The Wings are in a horrible place overall - blame weird lottery luck, blame Holland - whatever - bottom line is that Yzerman's rebuild has failed and they are stuck being a marginal play-off team at best in any near future. Yzerman constantly bemoans how hard it is to obtain stars - he wasn't able to when the team was bad and they were screwed by the lottery. That's water under the bridge now though, nothing to do about it. If they are going to move forward moving Larkin gives him the chance to have a sit down with Ilitch and say "If you support me I will start this over and we are going to be bad again but we are going to move enough players to get back into the draft and find the players to produce a winner in Raymond's and Seider's windows. 

Or they can keep stumbling along until Yzerman eventually gives up or Ilitch decides he's had enough. Or maybe some kind of unforeseen lighting strikes and some star falls in their lap.

However you look at it the light at the end of the tunnel for this team right now is the train coming at them.

[Shinzaki]

Helene St James says Larkin has submitted a list of three teams...Vegas, Minny and Florida.   

Give him a wider list or we'll see you at camp

[gehringer_2]

5 minutes ago, Shinzaki said:

Helene St James says Larkin has submitted a list of three teams...Vegas, Minny and Florida.   

Give him a wider list or we'll see you at camp

I don't think he'd hold out. He'll come to camp, put his head down and play and the situation for Mclelland will be intolerable until Yzerman moves him.

Edited Monday at 03:15 PM by gehringer_2

[Jason_R]

What do we think about timing? Does this get done before draft? On draft night? Between draft and camp? During camp? After start of season?

My guess is that it happens on or just before draft night. This gives Stevie three weeks to work the phones, ID credible trade partners, and negotiate the best outcome. I know Stevie is a tough negotiator and won’t be forced into a bad deal, but I also get the sense he would like this media circus over with. He would also like to come out of the draft with something to brag about, and to distract attention from Larkin. 

[gehringer_2]

1 minute ago, Jason_R said:

He would also like to come out of the draft with something to brag about, and to distract attention from Larkin.

absolutely

[lordstanley]

40 minutes ago, Hongbit said:

Thats your fan emotions getting the best of you. How would this help the Wings in any way?  I can’t really think of a dumber idea.

 Pay one of your best players not to play, have him take up cap space and don’t use his trade value to acquire a quality player(s) that want be here.  

It’s a negotiation between the player and the GM. Not every organization just caves when a player holds out. What if Larkin had given a 1 team list and dictated that Yzerman can only get draft picks back not roster players, would Yzerman  be expected to agree to that too? 3 teams isn’t reasonable, it ties Yzerman’s hands too much. Expand the list or else Yzerman and Larkin can call each other’s bluff. 

[Mr.TaterSalad]

1 hour ago, buddha said:

helene reporting that larkin's three teams are vegas, florida, and minnesota.

No thanks to any of these teams. I want high-end draft capital or top prospects for Larkin. Florida has the highest pick at #9. I don't know that any of these teams have a deep prospect pool, with a top six player in their prospect pool. I hope Yzerman asks him about San Jose and I hope Larkin says yes.

[gehringer_2]

3 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

No thanks to any of these teams. I want high-end draft capital or top prospects for Larkin. Florida has the highest pick at #9. I don't know that any of these teams have a deep prospect pool, with a top six player in their prospect pool. I hope Yzerman asks him about San Jose and I hope Larkin says yes.

Sounds like a situation where a three way deal could be the best answer. Does Yzerman have the skill to engineer one?

Edited Monday at 03:40 PM by gehringer_2

[Mr.TaterSalad]

Just now, gehringer_2 said:

Sound like a situation where a three way deal could be the best answer. Does Yzerman have the skill to engineer one?

No. He barley has the ability and stones to execute a one for one trade with other teams. I am fully prepared to be massively underwhelmed by the return we get. At best I think it is going to be a mid-level to late first round pick or second round pick + a second or third line player + maybe a mid-level prospect. 

I could see a trade with Florida looking something like Anton Lundell/C + 2027 2nd Round Pick (we won't get their #9 this year) + their #4 prospect Wilmer Skoog/C-LW.

[slothfacekilla]

LOL F you Dylan, three team list what a freaking diva.  Hope it is all worth it to tank your goodwill with your hometown fans.

[buddha]

26 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

No. He barley has the ability and stones to execute a one for one trade with other teams. I am fully prepared to be massively underwhelmed by the return we get. At best I think it is going to be a mid-level to late first round pick or second round pick + a second or third line player + maybe a mid-level prospect. 

I could see a trade with Florida looking something like Anton Lundell/C + 2027 2nd Round Pick (we won't get their #9 this year) + their #4 prospect Wilmer Skoog/C-LW.

he made multiple high end deals at tampa.

he also let jonathan drouin sit and stew rather than trade him for peanuts.  ended up with a really good player for him...

[Hongbit]

Nobody has any idea if the 3 teams named are the only teams he’d consider or the only teams he’d automatically waive the NTC.

It’s very possible that he’s open to other teams but on a case by case basis.   

[gehringer_2]

2 minutes ago, buddha said:

he made multiple high end deals at tampa.

working with a different staff. That's seems to be the recurring question about his tenure here, has he assembled as good a staff as he had in Tampa?

Edited Monday at 04:17 PM by gehringer_2

[Hongbit]

45 minutes ago, lordstanley said:

It’s a negotiation between the player and the GM. Not every organization just caves when a player holds out. What if Larkin had given a 1 team list and dictated that Yzerman can only get draft picks back not roster players, would Yzerman  be expected to agree to that too? 3 teams isn’t reasonable, it ties Yzerman’s hands too much. Expand the list or else Yzerman and Larkin can call each other’s bluff. 

There’s no need to bluff.  Dylan holds the cards.  He’s got enough money to sit out the season if he wants.  Steve is on the hot seat.  He needs to win right now.  He needs to be adding quality bodies and not losing them.  It’s more heat if he lets this drag into the season with Larkin holding out.   Stevie has to fold and trade him before the season. 

[lordstanley]

I hate posting Jeff Moss, but I’m sure he is right about this 

 

[lordstanley]

From The Atlantic’s Pierre LeBrun, should be readable even without a subscription. 
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/7336718/2026/06/05/steve-yzerman-dylan-larkin-trade-red-wings/?source=user_shared_article&unlocked_article_code=1.olA.MoEU.bGq1DLYFJRFn

“Because Brisson is aware of what many of us are: You push Yzerman into a corner now with this kind of public attention on the matter, who knows what may come of this situation”.

”Puts Detroit in a tough place,” said one NHL GM, who requested anonymity because the league prohibits talking about other teams’ players. “They don’t have to trade him. He signed the contract and got the full trade protection.”

If I were to read between the lines of what the GM was saying there, the message is that Yzerman would be within his rights to say, “OK, you want to be traded, but then I get every team in the league on the table. Not just a few teams.”

My understanding is that Yzerman has been handed a short list of teams at this point, but sometimes these things evolve, and that list can grow or change.

Again, who knows how Yzerman will decide to manage this? But putting a gun to his head is not advisable.”

 

[buddha]

12 minutes ago, Hongbit said:

There’s no need to bluff.  Dylan holds the cards.  He’s got enough money to sit out the season if he wants.  Steve is on the hot seat.  He needs to win right now.  He needs to be adding quality bodies and not losing them.  It’s more heat if he lets this drag into the season with Larkin holding out.   Stevie has to fold and trade him before the season. 

i dont think its that cut and dried.

saying he has "plenty of money" and all that, sure from our perspective.  but walking away from $8 million and missing time from your career in your prime is not so simple.

yzerman has plenty of money too.  he doesnt have to work anymore if he doesnt want to do this.  go ahead chris illitch, fire me.

larkin's leverage is the nmc.  yzerman's leverage is the contract.  you signed for 5 more years.  you can show up to camp and work until the team gets value for the asset.  he's done it before.

i suspect he will get the deal done to a team that larkin wants to go to.  i'm not sure if that's one of the teams supposedly on his list, but it might be.  

if im him, i'd be telling bill guerin to go get another team to be involved that wants wellstedt and then we can talk.

[lordstanley]

 

[gehringer_2]

17 minutes ago, Hongbit said:

He needs to win right now.  

Making the team better the day after the trade than the day before is going to be a very tough lift unless he is willing to take older players, in which case that just guarantees falling off the cliff later. Maybe if you package Cossa you can get enough to actually improve the team, but then what are you going to do when Gibson runs out of gas in the 2nd half again? Bank on Augustine I guess?

[gehringer_2]

11 minutes ago, buddha said:

if im him, i'd be telling bill guerin to go get another team to be involved that wants wellstedt and then we can talk.

this. Larkin is the perfect get for the Wild and *if* they can swing it so they lock up Hughes as part of the overall package - which is a real possibility, it's almost better than perfect for them. But the return fit for Det is poor. 

So my only quibble with the formulation is that Yzerman needs to be looking for that 3rd party fit as hard as he wants Guerin to. 

[buddha]

Just now, gehringer_2 said:

this. Larkin is the perfect get for the Wild and *if* they can swing it so they lock up Hughes as part of the overall package - which is a real possibility, it's almost better than perfect for them. But the return fit for Det is poor. 

So my only quibble with the formulation is that Yzerman needs to be looking for that 3rd party fit as hard as he wants Guerin to. 

the best will be when they trade larkin to minny and then quinn leaves after next year to play with his brothers in new jersey.

[gehringer_2]

10 minutes ago, buddha said:

the best will be when they trade larkin to minny and then quinn leaves after next year to play with his brothers in new jersey.

exactly - which is why Hughes is probably the 1st person Guerin talks to before deciding whether he's in or out. He gets a deal on the table with Hughes contingent on landing Larkin before he calls Yzerman back.

Edited Monday at 05:08 PM by gehringer_2

[Jason_R]

Yes Larkin has the NMC but I don’t see any way he refuses to waive it if Stevie brokers a deal that is good for Detroit with a team like San Jose, Anaheim, Utah, that is young and ready to move to the next level. Larkin doesn’t want to be a villain. He just wants to go and compete. If Guerin doesn’t think Larkin is worth what another GM does, or can’t pull together a deal, Larkin is going to have to sleep in the bed he made. 

[buddha]

19 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

Yes Larkin has the NMC but I don’t see any way he refuses to waive it if Stevie brokers a deal that is good for Detroit with a team like San Jose, Anaheim, Utah, that is young and ready to move to the next level. Larkin doesn’t want to be a villain. He just wants to go and compete. If Guerin doesn’t think Larkin is worth what another GM does, or can’t pull together a deal, Larkin is going to have to sleep in the bed he made. 

i think youre giving dylan larkin a lot of credit here.