Will Tigers Pony up for Skubal

[NorthWoods]

2 hours ago, Stormin said:

Boras has Petzold on speed dial.

Petzold hasn't loved me since I suggested he should do us all a favor and schedule a trip to Fiji for World Series week.

[oblong]

I can’t keep any of them straight. Aren’t there 3 guys name Evan?

[SoCalTiger]

As for Skubal's arbitration hearing I think the Tigers will just focus on the percent increase they offered is historic and that the players making more than Skubal simply could not have made that much in arbitration. It might not be a winning strategy but could play to a non baseball expert panel and it won't insult Skubal. 

[gehringer_2]

6 hours ago, Stormin said:

The Tigers would be best served by focusing on service time and what pitchers are being paid in 2026.

As I have thought about it, I think that whether implicitly or explicitly, the treatment of service time in arbitration is exactly what Skubal and Boras are making an attempt to change. Skubal, as a leader in the MLBPA, wants to argue about fairness and Skubal's real value. The Tigers - representing ownership, are going to argue for the status quo approach to service time cooked into current arbitration practice and that any break from that is an issue for the next CBA and not something that should be upset by a single arbitration panel decision. Personally, I think a system where players get paid more in line for what they are doing present tense and less about what they did 5 yrs ago is fine in theory, but it's not clear to me how to get there since too many teams probably couldn't afford their young stars on that basis.

Edited 22 hours ago by gehringer_2

[AlaskanTigersFan]

Isn't it amazing. In MLB, there are $60 million per year contracts being dished out. In Hockey, an AMAZING BREAK THE BANK contract is like $10 million a year...... Woof.

[gehringer_2]

17 minutes ago, AlaskanTigersFan said:

Isn't it amazing. In MLB, there are $60 million per year contracts being dished out. In Hockey, an AMAZING BREAK THE BANK contract is like $10 million a year...... Woof.

The TV market is apparently tiny. I find that ironic because the evolution of the hidef 16:9 format and the relatively few in game breaks has made hockey the best TV viewing sport of all.

[Tiger337]

6 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

The TV market is apparently tiny. I find that ironic because the evolution of the hidef 16:9 format and the relatively few in game breaks has made hockey the best TV viewing sport of all.

I would guess it's because there are limited areas in the United States where it is played very much by kids growing up.  

[gehringer_2]

15 minutes ago, Tiger337 said:

I would guess it's because there are limited areas in the United States where it is played very much by kids growing up.  

well, judging from the abandonment of diamonds in MI, baseball is doing it's best to match that.

[Tiger337]

20 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

well, judging from the abandonment of diamonds in MI, baseball is doing it's best to match that.

Pick up games are no longer popular, but organized baseball is still pretty popular.  I believe basketball and soccer are the top youth sports with baseball #3.   

[chasfh]

18 hours ago, Tenacious D said:

Of course,  why is this even being debated? Even Ilitch Jr would shoot him out of a cannon if he suspected that Harris was phoning it in with the Avila holdovers.

I was honestly asking for a clarification since so many people seem to suggest he doesn’t care about the roster or about Avila’s guys he’s inherited, but rather, only about hoarding prospects he himself is responsible for or something along those lines. I just wanted to make sure you meant what i read in your post. Thanks.

I think Harris cares enough about this roster and about winning that he is willing to keep Skubal to try to win this year, rather than trade him for more of his guys he can hoard.

[chasfh]

8 hours ago, AlaskanTigersFan said:

Isn't it amazing. In MLB, there are $60 million per year contracts being dished out. In Hockey, an AMAZING BREAK THE BANK contract is like $10 million a year...... Woof.

It’s difficult for people in Detroit to really feel this, but in the vast majority of the country, NHL hockey as roughly the same level of profile for them as the WNBA has for us.

[IdahoBert]

13 minutes ago, chasfh said:

It’s difficult for people in Detroit to really feel this, but in the vast majority of the country, NHL hockey as roughly the same level of profile for them as the WNBA has for us.

[oblong]

7 hours ago, chasfh said:

It’s difficult for people in Detroit to really feel this, but in the vast majority of the country, NHL hockey as roughly the same level of profile for them as the WNBA has for us.

Netflix might change that 🙂

[Edman85]

7 hours ago, chasfh said:

It’s difficult for people in Detroit to really feel this, but in the vast majority of the country, NHL hockey as roughly the same level of profile for them as the WNBA has for us.

I hear more about WNBA than NHL. Part of that is being active in a Purdue alumni club, and while Caitlin Clark went to Iowa, they follow the Fever because of her.

[Stormin]

9 hours ago, chasfh said:

It’s difficult for people in Detroit to really feel this, but in the vast majority of the country, NHL hockey as roughly the same level of profile for them as the WNBA has for us.

On Forbes, the highest value WNBA team is around $400M with annual revenue of around $25M.  Forbes doesn't list income for WNBA teams.  I not sure any are profitable.

NHL franchises are valued between $1B and $4B, all were profitable in 2025 with income exceeding $100M in somes cases, payrolls are generally around $100M.  RedWings are valued higher and bring in more income than the Tigers 

May not be high profile in some areas, but the NHL is doing alright financially.

Edited 3 hours ago by Stormin

[gehringer_2]

40 minutes ago, Stormin said:

RedWings are valued higher and bring in more income than the Tigers 

you'd have thought that would have reversed with the Tigers making two consecutive trips to the playoffs, but it seems the fans have been slow to embrace this Tiger team. I don't know if that is a baseball in general problem or just something about this Tiger team, or maybe just the messed up TV access situation.

[Edman85]

I think I have mentioned this before, but the reason I don't follow the NHL or root for the Red Wings is because I lived in an area that got WJR but not the backup station in the 90's (CKLW?). The Tigers only lost WJR priority when the Red Wings were in the playoffs, so naturally I rooted against them so I could listen to the Tigers.

[oblong]

10 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

you'd have thought that would have reversed with the Tigers making two consecutive trips to the playoffs, but it seems the fans have been slow to embrace this Tiger team. I don't know if that is a baseball in general problem or just something about this Tiger team, or maybe just the messed up TV access situation.

I think there's been a shift among the season ticket holder market.  Big time.  And it's a self inflicted.  Dynamic pricing and ease of using secondary markets.  Why commit, like I have for 30 years, for a 28 game package for a set # of games, including ****ty ones in April and Sept when it's cold, for a set price, when you can just pick and choose your own at the last minute, often for peanuts?  22 year old me may  not have made the committment I have over these years.  It's just a fixed part of my life and I'm used to it.  But younger me may have invested that in other forms of entertainment, like continuing on with golf or whatever.

Even with the Wings, I've gone to 2 games this year for $20 by waiting until around 6 pm on seatgeek.  No, the seats weren't great, but I was in the building. 

And with the casual nature of Comerica Park... just get in the stadium and you can mingle on their party decks they built... so that $10 nosebleed seat is irrelevant. Weren't sitting there anyway. 

And perhaps the Lions from the last 2-3 years killed off many potential purchases as people burned through their entertainment budgets?

[gehringer_2]

1 minute ago, oblong said:

I think there's been a shift among the season ticket holder market.  Big time.  And it's a self inflicted.  Dynamic pricing and ease of using secondary markets.  Why commit, like I have for 30 years, for a 28 game package for a set # of games, including ****ty ones in April and Sept when it's cold, for a set price, when you can just pick and choose your own at the last minute, often for peanuts?  22 year old me may  not have made the committment I have over these years.  It's just a fixed part of my life and I'm used to it.  But younger me may have invested that in other forms of entertainment, like continuing on with golf or whatever.

Even with the Wings, I've gone to 2 games this year for $20 by waiting until around 6 pm on seatgeek.  No, the seats weren't great, but I was in the building. 

And with the casual nature of Comerica Park... just get in the stadium and you can mingle on their party decks they built... so that $10 nosebleed seat is irrelevant. Weren't sitting there anyway. 

And perhaps the Lions from the last 2-3 years killed off many potential purchases as people burned through their entertainment budgets?

Sort of chicken and egg though. The Wings fill the house, season-ticket holders know if they give them up they don't get good seats. It's easy to get good Tiger tickets because not enough are already taken. But attendance $$ isn't even the biggest  financial driver anymore - it TV ratings. It's always reported the Tiger TV ratings are good, but either they aren't that good or the market just doesn't return enough $ out of those ratings to raise the value of the team.

[Sports_Freak]

19 hours ago, Tiger337 said:

I would guess it's because there are limited areas in the United States where it is played very much by kids growing up.  

My son never had any interest in playing ice hockey but I had a really good friend and his son played. He used to tell me how expensive it was as well as all the very early morning practices. 

[gehringer_2]

17 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said:

My son never had any interest in playing ice hockey but I had a really good friend and his son played. He used to tell me how expensive it was as well as all the very early morning practices. 

I'm seeing a more complaints that the cost is pricing middle class kids out of youth hockey.

[gehringer_2]

12 hours ago, chasfh said:

I was honestly asking for a clarification since so many people seem to suggest he doesn’t care about the roster or about Avila’s guys he’s inherited, but rather, only about hoarding prospects he himself is responsible for or something along those lines. I just wanted to make sure you meant what i read in your post. Thanks.

I think Harris cares enough about this roster and about winning that he is willing to keep Skubal to try to win this year, rather than trade him for more of his guys he can hoard.

I don't buy the narrative that Harris has any issue with the players he inherited at all. I think he been perfectly fair and rational in how he has handled everyone in the system since he arrived - both his and the prior picks. Nobody's been dumped, there have been no fire sales , no-one has been fast tracked that didn't earn it. I think he has tried to get as much out of everyone for the purpose of winning games that he could.

Edited 29 minutes ago by gehringer_2

[oblong]

2 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

Sort of chicken and egg though. The Wings fill the house, season-ticket holders know if they give them up they don't get good seats. It's easy to get good Tiger tickets because not enough are already taken. But attendance $$ isn't even the biggest  financial driver anymore - it TV ratings. It's always reported the Tiger TV ratings are good, but either they aren't that good or the market just doesn't return enough $ out of those ratings to raise the value of the team.

It’s also an issue of seats available, both per game and thru the season. I’d say just about 1/4.  The wings keep calling me for 10 games plans, which is just shy of the equivalent of my 28 games for the Tigers. But the cost is the same. I’ll probably do it if a current connection I have dries up after a retirement. 

[oblong]

1 minute ago, gehringer_2 said:

I don't buy the narrative that Harris has any issue with the players he inherited at all. I think he been perfectly fair and rational in how he has handled everyone in the system since he arrived - both his and the prior picks,  and has tried to get as much out of everyone for the purpose of winning games that he could.

Agree. And what’s he to do?  Just get rid of them? If he had any better options he would have done it. Might as well play the cards you had.