gehringer_2 Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Edman85 said: The first Tigers teams I was old enough to follow had Tettleton, Phillips, Cuyler, Kreuter. I don't really have a way to fact check, but I know that era was switch hitter heavy. RIght, but Tettleton and Phillips were exceptions over a long period. Cuyler/Kreuter weren't regulars so I'm not really counting them. Just as snapshots, the 68 championship team had none starting, likewise the 72 Divisional winner, 84 had one in Howard Baker who already had one foot out the door with Sparky (). 2006 was the first winning team I remember where SH played any major role, Guillen, Young, Santiago (N. Perez was a SH but I can't justify calling his time with the Tigers a 'role'!). But then by the 2012 WS team had only Ramon, and his role was minor. The recent stretch with W. Castro, Grossman, Reyes, Candelario, Barnhart, Niko, is really unusual, for any team really. I think it points the to fact that Avila did not just take SH as they came along but had to be making an effort to pursue them to have collected so many contemporaneously. Edited September 4, 2022 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 we seem to be having another Manning meltdown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 3 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: we seem to be having another Manning meltdown. If he wants to graduate to a higher echelon he'll have to stop that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 20 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: If he wants to graduate to a higher echelon he'll have to stop that... Kinda wondering if he's destined for the bullpen at this point... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalTiger Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 2 hours ago, gehringer_2 said: used to be you needed 43 days service time to get the 1st pension increment but so many things have been reworked since COVID I don't know if this site is up to date... https://awmcap.com/blog/mlb-service-time#:~:text=The full pension consists of,valued at %245%2C750 per quarter. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalTiger Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, casimir said: It’s tough to gauge right now without a GM in place. The pros and cons are probably equal in weight. I suspect he is brought back and they kick the longer term 3B decision down the road, but it’s just an uneducated guess. The question in my mind is if you bring him back and he plays well do you trust he will continue to do well if you sign him to a multi year free agent contract ? I wouldn’t so for me it’s non tender and move on. Edited September 4, 2022 by SoCalTiger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted September 4, 2022 Author Share Posted September 4, 2022 23 minutes ago, SoCalTiger said: The question in my mind is if you bring him back and he plays well do you trust he will continue to do well if you sign him to a multi year free agent contract ? I wouldn’t so for me it’s non tender and move on. I can’t see signing him to a multi year deal, but it all depends upon the language of the contract. Even if he has a good 2023, he has an inconsistent track record. So how many teams would look to sign him to a longer deal? Right now, I would imagine a nominal 2 year guaranteed deal would be tough for him to find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 8 minutes ago, casimir said: I can’t see signing him to a multi year deal, but it all depends upon the language of the contract. Even if he has a good 2023, he has an inconsistent track record. So how many teams would look to sign him to a longer deal? Right now, I would imagine a nominal 2 year guaranteed deal would be tough for him to find. There's been some speculation that you could still nontender him and that he might still be available for more favorable terms afterward.... That might be a risk worth taking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 29 minutes ago, SoCalTiger said: The question in my mind is if you bring him back and he plays well ... I bring him back just to be able to cover 3B for 1 year. That's it. The same thing we did in trading for Barnhart. Just as a stopgap to cover a spot for a year. If he does well, trade him at the deadline. That's it. There's no signing him to another contract... as we've seen, not enough consistency and there's been a definite drop this year, on both sides of the ball. That's it. For Jeimer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted September 4, 2022 Author Share Posted September 4, 2022 4 minutes ago, mtutiger said: There's been some speculation that you could still nontender him and that he might still be available for more favorable terms afterward.... That might be a risk worth taking. So, just throwing out numbers, say he’s looking at $7M for next season via arb. By more favorable, I assume you mean from the perspective of the Tigers? So something like, I don’t know, 2/$12M with incentives attached? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 I'd rather the $7 mill for 1 year than anything on a multi-year. Personal preference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 Just now, casimir said: So, just throwing out numbers, say he’s looking at $7M for next season via arb. By more favorable, I assume you mean from the perspective of the Tigers? So something like, I don’t know, 2/$12M with incentives attached? It really comes down to what he demands on the open market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 Not Candy's day... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted September 4, 2022 Author Share Posted September 4, 2022 1 minute ago, 1984Echoes said: I'd rather the $7 mill for 1 year than anything on a multi-year. Personal preference. I tend to agree. If they could attached a qualifier for the 2nd season, that might be different. Speaking of Candelario, poor defense allows the lead run to score. Is he reading this forum during the game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted September 4, 2022 Author Share Posted September 4, 2022 2 minutes ago, mtutiger said: It really comes down to what he demands on the open market. 1 minute ago, mtutiger said: Not Candy's day... He will not be including today on his resume video. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 6 minutes ago, casimir said: I tend to agree. If they could attached a qualifier for the 2nd season, that might be different. Speaking of Candelario, poor defense allows the lead run to score. Is he reading this forum during the game? Then again... Maybe he's looking for an early pathway out of Detroit...? And a non-tender...? Doesn't seem logical, but... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 (edited) Honestly a great question for Ed or Microline, but what would be a reasonable AAV projection for Candy on the open market given his past and his results this year? I know it's not $7mil, but just my intuition is that it it can't be much above $3mil AAV Edited September 4, 2022 by mtutiger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalTiger Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 I think Kreifl 15 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: I bring him back just to be able to cover 3B for 1 year. That's it. The same thing we did in trading for Barnhart. Just as a stopgap to cover a spot for a year. If he does well, trade him at the deadline. That's it. There's no signing him to another contract... as we've seen, not enough consistency and there's been a definite drop this year, on both sides of the ball. That's it. For Jeimer. Probably the general consensus opinion but for me it’s bye bye Candy. I’d rather let Kriedler stopgap third base with solid defense and hope he can hit at the MLB level. If so you have third covered for awhile. Then spend the 7 mil towards something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 (edited) 9 minutes ago, SoCalTiger said: ... Probably the general consensus opinion but for me it’s bye bye Candy. I’d rather let Kriedler stopgap third base with solid defense and hope he can hit at the MLB level. If so you have third covered for awhile. Then spend the 7 mil towards something else. That may also be the option. I don't know if the Org is there yet... I'm not, just yet... But we'll see soon enough this offseason what their thinking is... Edited September 4, 2022 by 1984Echoes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 37 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: I bring him back just to be able to cover 3B for 1 year. That's it. The same thing we did in trading for Barnhart. Just as a stopgap to cover a spot for a year. If he does well, trade him at the deadline. That's it. There's no signing him to another contract... as we've seen, not enough consistency and there's been a definite drop this year, on both sides of the ball. That's it. For Jeimer. the problem is arb $. We are going to have to cut him loose to get out from under that and maybe someone offers him something before the Tigers do, but that's a risk I'd be happy to take. He isn't worth what an arbitrator is going to give him. Spend those $ somewhere else if some one else signs him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 I've been a long time advocate for Wilmer Flores on this board and feel he's an unusually good fit for their needs. And not just because his brother is one of the Tigers top prospects... because he can play both first and third fairly well and is would be their best hitter if he was on the team this year. Best case scenario never happens. But he'd be a better stopgap than Candy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 Pineda seems like a good guy, but it's the right thing to do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 48 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: the problem is arb $ The money doesn't mean a thing to me. And besides, I think it's going to be very difficult to spend our money this offseason... We don't exactly resemble a "Go-To" location this winter. At least not until this team/ new GM fixes a few things and we start back up to looking better on the field. I think it takes next year to recover Org value/ destination value... Just my 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 50 minutes ago, mtutiger said: I've been a long time advocate for Wilmer Flores on this board and feel he's an unusually good fit for their needs. And not just because his brother is one of the Tigers top prospects... because he can play both first and third fairly well and is would be their best hitter if he was on the team this year. Best case scenario never happens. But he'd be a better stopgap than Candy I would agree with this... But how do you get him away from the Giants? Even if he's a FA (I didn't check contract status)... the same question applies: how do you get him away from the Giants/ California... to come to Michigan? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted September 4, 2022 Share Posted September 4, 2022 (edited) 8 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: The money doesn't mean a thing to me. And besides, I think it's going to be very difficult to spend our money this offseason... We don't exactly resemble a "Go-To" location this winter. At least not until this team/ new GM fixes a few things and we start back up to looking better on the field. I think it takes next year to recover Org value/ destination value... Just my 2 cents. I understand the angle about not caring what the owner spends, and I don't, at least wrt how it impacts ownership. But the reality is that as a fan, I also know that this owner has a budget, and if I want to see a good team, then I have to hope that the owner spends his budget effectively, because for most owners, and almost certainly this one, the budget is the budget, win or lose. And I'd rather have win. Edited September 4, 2022 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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