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#17 Michigan @ #100 Michigan State University


romad1
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Two universities in the state of Michigan will play a football game at Noon on Saturday the 30th.  Known in the past in the Detroit area as Devil's Night except it will be played at Noon.   Michigan and Michigan State both come in undefeated at football this season so the Fox crew will shift from fluffing up seditionists to promoting a noisy broadcast featuring Gus Johnson and Joel Klatt.

My kid is in application mode so this is why this comes up.   Rankings based on US News and World Report's college rankings of Global Universities.   I understand that Michigan exceeded 50,000 last year so these numbers might not be up to date.   

 

Tale of the tape

https://www.usnews.com/education/best-global-universities/university-of-michigan-ann-arbor-170976

Total number of students

43,873

Number of international students

7,551

Total number of academic staff

5,308

Number of international staff

972

Number of undergraduate degrees awarded

7,450

Number of master's degrees awarded

4,677

Number of doctoral degrees awarded

1,556

Number of research only staff

1,835

Number of new undergraduate students

6,826

Number of new master's students

3,470

Number of new doctoral students

1,668

Subject Rankings

https://www.usnews.com/education/best-global-universities/michigan-state-university-171100

Key facts:

Total number of students

45,678

Number of international students

7,113

Total number of academic staff

2,755

Number of international staff

672

Number of undergraduate degrees awarded

9,120

Number of master's degrees awarded

2,240

Number of doctoral degrees awarded

1,138

Number of research only staff

511

Number of new undergraduate students

10,346

Number of new master's students

1,578

Number of new doctoral students

1,080

Subject Rankings

 

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36 minutes ago, romad1 said:

Now, I'm curious about the space science ratings.  Michigan has the https://cygnss.engin.umich.edu/

satellite program.

What helps OSU...

this little cube sat is all I'm seeing thus far

https://news.osu.edu/ohio-states-first-satellite-prepares-for-launch/

Wonder if OSU bought their ranking

everybody does cube sats.

However, interestingly, and not that I make any kind of effort to actually track this stuff so I could be wrong, but my impression has been the UM College of Eng does more cooperative work with OSU than MSU. The Engineers at both schools sharing in common the universal nerd disdain for the jocks.

Edited by gehringer_2
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I have no guess what a Michigan win in this game would look like, but I can write the script easily enough for the loss: The M defense plays stoutly through 3 quarters but gives up two home runs, meanwhile the M offense in fits and starts struggles to put up 2 FGs. Finally, down by 8 and time running out, Harbaugh hands the keys to McCarthy, who engineers a brilliant drive to close the gap to 2. Harbaugh elects to go for two and the inevitable trick play call blows up. MSU immediately drives for a FG. M gets the ball back into McCarthy's hands and they rip off 70 of the 80 yards they need to score and the kid throws the INT. MSU 17, M 12.

Edited by gehringer_2
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35 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

I have no guess what a Michigan win in this game would look like, but I can write the script easily enough for the loss: The M defense plays stoutly through 3 quarters but gives up two home runs, meanwhile the M offense in fits and starts struggles to put up 2 FGs. Finally, down by 8 and time running out, Harbaugh hands the keys to McCarthy, who engineers a brilliant drive to close the gap to 2. Harbaugh elects to go for two and the inevitable trick play call blows up. MSU immediately drives for a FG. M gets the ball back into McCarthy's hands and they rip off 70 of the 80 yards they need to score and the kid throws the INT. MSU 17, M 12.

Negative jinx 

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9 hours ago, Motor City Sonics said:

Michigan State 27, Michigan 9.   Then Michigan loses to Indiana, Penn State, escapes Maryland with a win and gives up 70 vs. Ohio State.     They go to the Living in The Past Bowl vs. Tennessee and Joe Milton torches them.   8-5 season.  Harbaugh comes back for another year.  

 

Hope I'm wrong.  

i dont think they get 70.

65?  quite possibly.

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My wife is a sparty and highly accomplished in life.  I think the general quality of education she got plus her own native drive and intellect were fine. 

My interest in sending my son to a "good school" in the top 100 of whatever category is just scoreboard of his/our success raising him.  The ratings are likely just junk like you say.  We've been to a couple campuses on our tours.  Michigan is a very nice one.  UVA also very nice.  Some are just utilitarian.  

In my own story...my terrible HS grades (we are talking Blutarski level gpa here) were mitigated when I finally realized I needed to get going:  tested well on the ASVAB, joined the Air Force, got community college going, did well enough in University of Maryland overseas courses in the Air Force, got off active duty and applied for University of Michigan based on my CC and University of Maryland courses.  I never had to write any essays or do well on the SAT.  I showed up and worked hard because I gave a damn so it worked out for me. 

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Come visit William and Mary. Depending on his major I’d say the quality of education is similar to both UVa and U of M. It still has the small town feel (Charlottesville has sprawled out of control in recent years). 
 

The sports teams are nothing to write home about, but.

 

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/william-and-mary-3705

Edited by CMRivdogs
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6 minutes ago, CMRivdogs said:

Come visit William and Mary. Depending on his major I’d say the quality of education is similar to both UVa and U of M. It still has the small town feel (Charlottesville has sprawled out of control in recent years). 
 

The sports teams are nothing to write home about, but.

 

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/william-and-mary-3705

Known among his peers as "Suicide U" for some reason.  Its on his list but we haven't visited so it holds lower enthusiasm for him. 

Edited by romad1
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3 hours ago, romad1 said:

My wife is a sparty and highly accomplished in life.  I think the general quality of education she got plus her own native drive and intellect were fine. 

My interest in sending my son to a "good school" in the top 100 of whatever category is just scoreboard of his/our success raising him.  The ratings are likely just junk like you say.  We've been to a couple campuses on our tours.  Michigan is a very nice one.  UVA also very nice.  Some are just utilitarian.  

In my own story...my terrible HS grades (we are talking Blutarski level gpa here) were mitigated when I finally realized I needed to get going:  tested well on the ASVAB, joined the Air Force, got community college going, did well enough in University of Maryland overseas courses in the Air Force, got off active duty and applied for University of Michigan based on my CC and University of Maryland courses.  I never had to write any essays or do well on the SAT.  I showed up and worked hard because I gave a damn so it worked out for me. 

As long as one isn't going to a school that is for-profit (think the schools whose students were bailed out of their loans by the Biden admin), you will receive a roughly equal quality of education across the board. With rare exception, it's not like the information being taught about subject matter is fundamentally different between a HYPSM and a "lower tier" state school. Depending on what someone is interested in, any number of schools may make sense for any number of reasons. If you want to do research, a HYPSM is going to have money they don't know what to do with to fund whatever your little heart desires. At the same time, if you have specific interests and those interests are to a 't' met by a professor at Eastern Michigan, that may make more sense for you. This is even before financial considerations. Stanford would not be worth a $50,000 price tag if one is offered a full-ride to Michigan.

The ratings have more to do with donors and money (the first bucket I mentioned) than anything else.

My own story is that I was very middle-of-the-road in high school. Finished with a 3.2 GPA or so. Went to Oakland Community College and figured out how to do life and school. One Biology course I can remember clearly, I got a D on the first exam and said to myself I was going to apply myself, go get it, and see what happened. Got no less than a 93 on a test the rest of that semester. I applied to transfer to Michigan after a few semesters and they rejected me, citing I didn't have enough credits to say I was the near 4.0 CC student and not the near 3.0 HS student. The following year, 40 more credits under the belt, I applied to ten schools with a 3.95 GPA: Michigan, Michigan State, Harvard, Penn, Vanderbilt, NYU, Columbia, Cornell, Brown, and Stanford. All rejected me except Michigan, MSU, and Stanford, and I decided to go west of the Mississippi River for the first time in my life as I drove out for orientation. I was in a cohort of 26 transfers that class.

I wouldn't change anything, I had a great time and did pretty well for myself, graduating with a BA and a 3.88 GPA. But I also believe that a lot of the hype around undergraduate education at those top US schools is just lore and toxic comparison of self vs others than anything else. I don't think I'm any smarter (however you choose to define the word) or better prepared than my colleagues who went to Oakland University or Wayne State. Part of that certainly has to do with my field (majored in Psychology and work in child welfare - if I was a Computer Science guy it would be a different story), but overall, if I were speaking to someone who was making a decision on colleges (for undergrad), fit and comfortability is much more important than pretty arbitrary rankings.

/soapbox

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It looks like they had a rough year a while back and there was a disproportionate number of suicides. The school does have a reputation of being a nerd school with not too many parties (unlike that party school in Charlottesville)

I should note my spouse is a UVa grad. Class of ‘72 one of the first groups of women to graduate there. She’s done very well. It toughened her up.

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The kid is into the idea of solving the problem of plastic in the environment.  U-Chicago appears to be the one that fits that niche interest very well.   I would always be getting asks for things like gallium and other "fun" elements for Christmas.   I keep saying that he needs to go to a proper large university because he is also a huge history and writing nerd who would love nothing more than to invent his own RPG system.  

He is so un-street smart that I'd worry he's be eaten alive by the big school drive to drink yourself to death except he's a very wise kid.  Knows what not to eat, etc.   

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Michigan State is the second Pete from Pete & Pete, the little brother of the show.

This is it though for Harbaugh, win and look good doing it and you'll start to rebuild trust among the fan base that wanted you axed, lose and we'll just keep calling for your head. I think Michigan needs to find a way to open up this offense because I don't think they can bully ball their way through the game with running the ball down State's throat. They are going to have to find a way to attack down the field and open up the playbook a little bit. Gattis is going to have to put some wrinkles in his play calls otherwise State is going to stack the box and stop Michigan. I think they are just going to have to place confidence and trust in Cade and let him go downfield more often.

Edited by Mr.TaterSalad
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