Jason_R Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 2 minutes ago, RedRamage said: Which again is why I want that other special status... Based on what info is being thrown around it certainly seems likely that there's fire tied to this smoke. But we don't know for sure, and independent of this situation there may be other situations where it's less clear if there's fire or not. A team is in a catch-22... if they cut the player and he's found innocent, they potentially lost out on his talent. The player gets a public black eye because he was cut and losing out on his salary. But if a team doesn't cut the player right quickly and he's found guilty the team gets the black eye for paying and associating with a bad individual. A temporary status protects the teams and the players and the image. "We're temporarily disassociating ourselves from this player until all the facts are known and he has his day in court. If he's guilty, he's gone and doesn't get back pay. If he's innocent he's restore to full status and gets his back pay." They won’t cut him until the legal process plays out and they can point to the player as having violated personal conduct provisions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 21 minutes ago, Jason_R said: They will cut him. No chance Sheila will allow him to stay on the roster. I'm guess the Lions are looking over their options to cut him with the least impact to the salary cap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRamage Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 2 minutes ago, Jason_R said: They won’t cut him until the legal process plays out and they can point to the player as having violated personal conduct provisions. Which again is part of the problem. This makes sense legally speaking, but optically the narrative is this guy threw his gf out a third story window and now is evading police... but the Lions are still employing him? Still paying him? Do they not care about women!?!? Do they not care about stopping domestic violence?!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason_R Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 1 minute ago, RedRamage said: Which again is part of the problem. This makes sense legally speaking, but optically the narrative is this guy threw his gf out a third story window and now is evading police... but the Lions are still employing him? Still paying him? Do they not care about women!?!? Do they not care about stopping domestic violence?!? No it’s not part of the problem. The Lions are not guilty of anything. And what are they paying him? There are no games so there are no game checks. He may have a roster bonus or a workout bonus that kick in near training camp but those are unlikely to be earned at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 I’m not a legal expert but I’m guessing bond none is not good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyBlue Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Almost as if the Lions knew something was going when they added two DB's in the last week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganCardinal Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 I wonder if the Lions are looking to have Goodell place him on the Commissioner’s Exempt List. I believe doing so would mean he would not be included in the present cap figure. At such a point as he is officially found to have violated his contract (thus forfeiting the guaranteed money) he could likely be released at a fraction of the dead cap hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason_R Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Just now, GoBlue23 said: Based on this answer, I think it's possible the Lions knew nothing about this before today. I stand corrected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KL2 Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 1 minute ago, Motown Bombers said: I’m not a legal expert but I’m guessing bond none is not good. it just means a no bond warrant. So the person will have to go before a judge/magistrate who will set bond. Standard practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganCardinal Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 1 minute ago, Motown Bombers said: I’m not a legal expert but I’m guessing bond none is not good. Me either. But he hasn’t been arraigned so it likely just means that he has to stay in custody until arraigned, at which point the judge or magistrate will set a bond. He can’t just turn himself in, post bond, and leave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRamage Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 9 minutes ago, Jason_R said: No it’s not part of the problem. The Lions are not guilty of anything. And what are they paying him? There are no games so there are no game checks. He may have a roster bonus or a workout bonus that kick in near training camp but those are unlikely to be earned at this point. No, the Lions aren't legally guilty of anything. But public opinion =/= legal standing. If the court of public opinion says Sutton is guilty and a despicable person, the Lions be keeping him on the roster are also guilty (in the court of public opinion) by not disassociating themselves. Depends on if they are only paying him in season or if it's split over 12 months. My wife, a teacher, gets paid year round even though she only teaches ~9months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KL2 Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 3 minutes ago, RedRamage said: No, the Lions aren't legally guilty of anything. But public opinion =/= legal standing. If the court of public opinion says Sutton is guilty and a despicable person, the Lions be keeping him on the roster are also guilty (in the court of public opinion) by not disassociating themselves. Depends on if they are only paying him in season or if it's split over 12 months. My wife, a teacher, gets paid year round even though she only teaches ~9months. They are paid 18 times a year after each week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganCardinal Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 I can be spared from the pearl clutching. It's possible to simultaneously be disgusted by the allegations and domestic violence generally while still wondering what the implications to the team are. There is not a mandatory period of deeper sociological thought required here. I think it's inappropriate for Payton to police people's sympathies and thoughts like this. It also bears mention that for some number of people to whom domestic violence is a very real part of their life, sport serves as a healthy distraction. For those people especially, telling them to think about the domestic violence right now instead of the sport can be incredibly tone deaf to the realities (and prevalence) of domestic violence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLion Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Well, this is bad. Putting aside the football aspect of it which is relatively unimportant, these allegations are really bad and him allegedly evading the police makes it even worse. It's prudent to wait for my details to come out before burning him at the stake but, yeah, not looking good for Cam to say the least. In terms of the football aspect, the Lions should act quickly with this so they can move forward while there are still some free agents out there because you don't want to shoehorn yourself into needing to draft a corner with a high pick. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRamage Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Hey Mike, domestic abuse happens every day. I'm assuming you've never thoughts about mundane things during this time because your focus has always been on the victims of this abuse, right? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 1 minute ago, NYLion said: Well, this is bad. Putting aside the football aspect of it which is relatively unimportant, these allegations are really bad and him allegedly evading the police makes it even worse. It's prudent to wait for my details to come out before burning him at the stake but, yeah, not looking good for Cam to say the least. In terms of the football aspect, the Lions should act quickly with this so they can move forward while there are still some free agents out there because you don't want to shoehorn yourself into needing to draft a corner with a high pick. Stephon Gilmore seems like a good idea now. Even if Sutton remains on the Lions, he no doubt will be suspended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLion Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 2 hours ago, Motown Bombers said: Lions would only save $1.5 million in cap space if he's cut post June 1st. If the allegations are true, they are going to cut bait with him WAY before June 1st so I don't see that being an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLion Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Just now, Motown Bombers said: Stephon Gilmore seems like a good idea now. Even if Sutton remains on the Lions, he no doubt will be suspended. Yeah, Gilmore is who came to mind immediately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Just now, NYLion said: If the allegations are true, they are going to cut bait with him WAY before June 1st so I don't see that being an issue. I believe they could cut him now with a post June 1st designation. It would save them a lot of cap space to do it that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordstanley Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 6 minutes ago, MichiganCardinal said: I can be spared from the pearl clutching. It's possible to simultaneously be disgusted by the allegations and domestic violence generally while still wondering what the implications to the team are. There is not a mandatory period of deeper sociological thought required here. I think it's inappropriate for Payton to police people's sympathies and thoughts like this. It also bears mention that for some number of people to whom domestic violence is a very real part of their life, sport serves as a healthy distraction. For those people especially, telling them to think about the domestic violence right now instead of the sport can be incredibly tone deaf to the realities (and prevalence) of domestic violence. Right. If this was during the season and people were saying “well, looks like Sutton committed a serious crime but we have an important game coming up and we should play him anyways this weekend because we really need to beat the Packers”, then I would agree with Payton. But that’s not what is happening. People are thinking that it is highly likely to be the end of Sutton in Detroit, so fine, what does that mean for the cap and how do the Lions plug this new hole. No one is saying law enforcement or the NFL should look the other way just because it impacts the Lions’ secondary. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganCardinal Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 (edited) Posted for context: Maximum penalties for a third-degree felony is five years in prison, but the ultimate sentence if convicted will be dependent on a whole host of other factors. Sutton deserves his day in court like anyone else, but these are very serious allegations. Based on everything out there right now, I think the Lions should be exploring options to cut ties. Edited March 20 by MichiganCardinal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLion Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 39 minutes ago, SkyBlue said: Almost as if the Lions knew something was going when they added two DB's in the last week. They needed to add two DBs even with Sutton. I highly doubt that the Lions knew about this for 2 weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Reports are the girlfriend had injuries so I'm guessing strangulation marks on her neck. He may very well of played his last game in the NFL. He's not good enough for a team to take on this baggage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRamage Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 13 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: Reports are the girlfriend had injuries so I'm guessing strangulation marks on her neck. He may very well of played his last game in the NFL. He's not good enough for a team to take on this baggage. Yeah, assuming it's true this is a bad crime and a bad, bad look for any team that would take him on. In theory he could rehabilitate himself over a few years and maybe make a comeback, but given he was never a star player and is already 29 I don't see that being likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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