Who should be the next Lions OC?

[Mr.TaterSalad]

21 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

The Lions talent fits Petzing better than Arizona. Murray in not an under center dropback QB like Goff. 

I agree. I was only posting Petzing's stats in Arizona to share them with the group and as a point of discussion in the event there is anything we can learn from the number. I don't think it is an indictment on him as a coordinator and play caller though. Goff is a better overall QB than Murray. He's more accurate, has better mechanics, makes better decisions with the ball, and stays healthy unlike Murray. As you said, Petzing seems to have an offensive system and playbook built around a more traditional, under center QB. Designed for more runs and play action. Given Goff's a better fit than Murray and has proven he can stay healthy, I think this will be more of a true tell for who Petzing is as a coordinator now that he has the personnel to fit his scheme.

[lordstanley]

 

[RatkoVarda]

2 hours ago, StrangeBird said:

I will wait to see the results on the field, but this not an inspiring hire. I see no track record of success or innovative thinking with this guy.

I’m starting to wonder if MCDC has what it takes to lead this team to sustained success and a Super Bowl. Is it possible that the successes of 2023 and 2024 were more Ben Johnson’s offensive play-calling and less MCDC?

Dan and Brad dragged this garbage franchise out of hell and into the playoffs

But we shall see if they can make the next step

[Motor City Sonics]

1 hour ago, Jason_R said:

 

It's like what Mike tells Walter in Breaking Bad.   Just cause you shot Jesse James, it doesn't make YOU Jesse James. 

[Motor City Sonics]

Is this Pretzel guy, or whatever, really good with O-Lines or something?      Hiring anyone from Arizona's staff doesn't move the needle for me much. 

 

But maybe I need to stick with my feelings about Kyler Murray.   That, while being dazzling and flashy, at times, he's not that good and not a winner  and maybe the failure of Arizona is more on him than it is on Kingsbury, Gannon or Mr. Pretzel.       (sorry, I'm just gonna call him that). 

Edited Monday at 11:33 PM by Motor City Sonics

[Jason_R]

 

[Jason_R]

Wait… is that you, Coach Lalonde?

[NYLion]

I didn't care much for the McDaniel hype, very mediocre results with a claim to fame being a Shanahan disciple, but this hire is very underwhelming. 

With that said, will just have to trust Dan on this one. He's been 1 for 3 so far with his OC hires so....not great. We'll see

[Motown Bombers]

17 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

Wait… is that you, Coach Lalonde?

You would think being that short he would be able to better utilize Kyler Murray. 

[NYLion]

3 hours ago, papalawrence said:

I was confident they'd land a guy with a proven track record. I'm underwhelmed. Hate to say this, but if this hire doesn't help them to the playoffs next year, might coach Campbell be on the hot seat?

I don't think so but it might start to get warm which seems crazy considering they were 15-2 just last year but two missed playoffs with all this talent and two botched OC hires would probably make things uneasy in Allen Park.

[Motown Bombers]

 

[Jason_R]

 

[MichiganCardinal]

Really good post on Reddit about the Petzing hire if you're wanting a reason to be optimistic. Here's the original source.

Quote

So your team hired Drew Petzing

As a Cardinals fan really into Xs and Os, I'm here to tell you why I think your team made a slam dunk hire. You'll hear a lot of noise about your new OC from Cardinals fans - that he sucks, he doesn't know how to use players correctly, that he doesn't know offense. I think they're all wrong. And if I can't convince you of that, I can at least give you some insight as to what you're getting with Drew Petzing. Also gotta mention, I called this **** in advance.

Note about AI: I always get accused of writing with AI any time I write a post like this. I'm not ****in' using AI. I have never used AI for a Reddit post, not once. Run my **** through an AI detector if you don't believe me. I have a degree in writing, AI and I have been trained on the same ****. But I'm not using AI.

An innovator of 13 personnel

Sean McVay gets a whole lot of credit for implementing a scheme that uses 13-personnel a whole lot, and getting explosive passing plays out of them. The idea is simple - defenses match 12 with a big nickel personnel nowadays, but still match 13 with base. And three linebackers just leaves you susceptible in the pass game, even if opposing offenses go heavy - modern tight ends are too fast and athletic for a base defense to hold up. It may surprise you to learn - Drew Petzing was doing this first. Last season, the Cardinals ran 13 personnel at the second highest rate in the NFL, second only to the Steelers. And unlike the Steelers, who were awful at it, the Drew Petzing offense ranked first in EPA when in 13 personnel.

In fact, of all meaningful personnel groupings (10% of team snaps or greater) Petzing's passing offense out of 13 was the second best group in the league, with an astronomical 0.56 EPA per play. Only the Bucs' 21 personnel was better. It's hard to overstate how impressive that is. The Cardinals ran 13 personnel more than 30 other teams, and were the very best at it. It's a copycat league, and scheme is stolen, not invented. Petzing gave McVay a first-hand look at how effective offenses can be passing out of heavy personnel. Petzing absolutely destroyed the Rams in 2024 with 12 and 13 personnel. It's no surprise why McVay would go on to use these looks the following season.

Here's a big touchdown play. The Rams come out in base, matching the Cardinals three tight ends. 87, the blocking, big boy tight end lines up as the sole outside receiver. The Rams are running a quarters coverage. The ball is not going to the offense's right, but the Rams have a dropping corner and a safety to that side. It makes the left side completely outleveraged. On the left, you have a sail concept. Every team runs Sail, every defense practices guarding Sail. What makes it work is how you dress it up, and calling it at the right time. 2nd and 8 where the Rams want to keep a shell over the offense but in base personnel is makes this work. With the weak side defenders occupied by a single blocking tight end, you have two defensive backs against a McBride deep out and a Marvin Harrison Jr go ball. The linebackers are a non-factor. They're occupied by the shallow route, and they're not quick enough to disrupt the verticality of McBride's route. All the QB has to do is read the strong side safety. The safety I have circled jumps on the out route, meaning MHJ has a one-on-one in the endzone with a step on his man. Six.

Here's another example of how Petzing schemes up 13. Coming into this game, the Cardinals ranked 1st in passing EPA vs. base defense, while the Bears defense ranked first in defensive EPA in base. It was a strength vs. strength matchup, and the Cardinals blew the Bears out. What made 13 so effective for the Cardinals was the variety of play action Petzing ran. Petzing, coming from the Kubiak-Stefanski tree, is a master of play action, perfect for Jared Goff. In this play, you have TE Elijah Higgins, running a intermediate crosser. He gets wide open because the LB that's supposed to disrupt his route is completely bamboozled. A Sam linebacker's key in the run game is the opposite side guard. The right guard here pulls across the formation, which makes #57 hellbent on replacing his DE who's about to eat the block. The other two LBs bite on the run fake as well. To me, this demonstrates such a thorough understanding of offense. Where a linebacker's keys are, how they'll react to a pulling guard, and how to get linebackers stepping up to fill the run. And what you get is a wide open receiver.

The run game

With Drew Petzing, you get a lot of familiar looks that most every team runs. Sail, flood, levels, mesh. But he's very very good at mixing them up and calling them at the right time to exploit the defense he's up against. He's particularly good at running them all out of the same formation, the same formation that a lot of run plays come from. It's a well-disguised system. The crux of it is playing a lot of tight ends tight to the formation, forcing defenses to condense as they respect the threat of the run, and exploiting the space they leave behind. So naturally, none of that is possible without a good run game.

Petzing calls a very diverse run game. He majors in the body-on-body, downhill gap scheme kind of stuff that rewards a strong, patient runner. He loves to pull a guard. He'll do this at every opportunity. Notice how similar this run looks to play-action of the play above. Because the backers are slow to trigger on this run, LT Paris Johnson Jr. has the chance to throw his guy to the ground and still get a block on the middle linebacker. It's pretty easy to imagine Penei Sewell thriving at this role. The success of this 1Q play perfectly disguises the previous 4Q play. The run punishes the LBs for not triggering fast enough, the play-action punishes them for overcompensating and triggering too quickly.

Here's a much longer post I wrote about the diverse gap scheme Petzing gets into. It's all pretty sound stuff and springs all kinds of big plays. And I would be remiss if I didn't mention all the fun whams and split blocks he calls with his tight ends. It's a tough defense to play as a D-lineman. You think you're unblocked, and then boom, you're in the dirt. Watch #87 here.. It doesn't always work, but Petzing is willing to put all these weird blocks on tape that'll get defenses overthinking. Here's one where McBride puts in a really weak block that gets the play blown up. Not a good play, but it will serve to disguise a route later in the game when McBride runs across the formation.

Last season, the Cardinals run game ranked 5th in EPA/rush. 6th in overall success rate. 4th in early down success rate, early down EPA/play, and early down EPA/rush. Last season Drew Petzing called what was inarguably a top 5 run game. With journeymen at LG and C and backups at RG and RT. The only big money player on the O-line was Jonah Williams at RT, who suffered a season ending injury in Week 1.

2025 and beyond

The offense took a big ol' **** in 2025, that part is undeniable. But I truly don't think the playcalling was anywhere near the biggest culprit, or even bad. By far the biggest problem was the front office. The GM brought in ZERO offensive players in the draft and free agency. Every pick and dime was spent on defensive players. Petzing was dealt a raw deal. Both the RG and RT coming back from season ending injuries were clearly old and washed.

The lack of reinforcements reared its ugly head when the franchise LT went on IR, the journeyman LG missed time for personal reasons (child nearly stillborn), James Conner, Trey Benson, Emari Demarcado, Bam Knight all got injured at one point or another. Throw in Kyler Murray who had one of the highest sack rates in the league while throwing deep less than almost every other QB (an issue that was mysteriously solved when backup Jacoby Brissett started playing - clearly not the result of playcalling). This offense was unworkable.

TL;DR:

I think it's important to remember that only last year, Drew Petzing called a top 10 offense with a top 5 run game. That his 13 personnel passing game has been studied all around the NFL. He's done it before and he can do it again. I think Drew Petzing is a really good hire. As someone that has actually studied this man's playcalling.

 

Edited 9 hours ago by MichiganCardinal