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03/01/2023 7:00 EDT Chicago Bulls vs Detroit Pistons


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1 hour ago, RandyMarsh said:

Just heard on the radio that the last time the Pistons beat the Bulls they featured a lineup with Blake, Reggie Jackson and Jon Leuer, so yeah it's been awhile.

I had forgotten all about Jon Leuer.  What kind of fan am I?

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5 hours ago, Deleterious said:

I get he has family ties to the Detroit area.  But did he really need to do his Webber imitation?

 

I feel bad for him, but he should know the situation.  It'll be a learning experience.  This is the season to get this particular one out of the way.

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3 hours ago, Deleterious said:

Good February for Ivey.  16.4 PPG, 2.7 RPG, 5.8 APG.  He shot 41% from three and his TS% was 57%.  

He's still a work in progress, but the growth and development in Ivey this year is clearly visible in both his stats and the eye test.

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All the key guys are works in progress.

And Cade missed his second year which slows that progress.

But I am hoping by at least next year mid-season, if not sooner... that all these kids start to gel and start making some rapid on-court growth...

Might not mean we avoid the lottery next year... but if they could show the improvement with a rapid increase in wins by season's end... At least we'd have an idea that these kids could actually be the right foundation for future competitive teams.

I think they are. But it's too early to know for certain and there's just way too much learning curve left for most of them, and too much mistakes, and losses.

So... we'll see.

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They've accumulated a lot of talent.

Even if it's mismatched at this point.

And we still have the 2023 1st round pick high up in this draft... to add another piece.

But the ball is squarely in the "development" court right now.

Bigly. Casey has a big job to develop all of these kids...

Which...

Still doesn't guarantee wins or playoffs yet.

But yeah, they need to start working in that direction next year.

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On 3/2/2023 at 9:59 AM, Deleterious said:

Good February for Ivey.  16.4 PPG, 2.7 RPG, 5.8 APG.  He shot 41% from three and his TS% was 57%.  

Meanwhile, the Rookie of the Month is Paolo and his averages are:

16.6 PPG, 3.3 APG. 7.5 RPG, 37% FG, and 3% 3FG, on 45% TS

No, that's not a typo. He shot 3% (1 for 33) from 3 point range in February.

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23 hours ago, Betrayer said:

He's still a work in progress, but the growth and development in Ivey this year is clearly visible in both his stats and the eye test.

Yeah but my only problem is that this development could be stunted because he won't be running the team next season with Cade back (presumably). He's being deployed as the floor general now but will likely be more off ball with Cade back so I'm unsure of the fit long term.

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6 minutes ago, NYLion said:

Yeah but my only problem is that this development could be stunted because he won't be running the team next season with Cade back (presumably). He's being deployed as the floor general now but will likely be more off ball with Cade back so I'm unsure of the fit long term.

Sounds like another reason for Casey to be gone this off season.

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34 minutes ago, NYLion said:

Yeah but my only problem is that this development could be stunted because he won't be running the team next season with Cade back (presumably). He's being deployed as the floor general now but will likely be more off ball with Cade back so I'm unsure of the fit long term.

I hear the concern, but I don't think it's that black and white of an issue. Ivey has plenty of reps off-ball with Killian (or CoJo) running the point, so I think he's seeing both scenarios.

We also shouldn't expect Cade to initiate the offense 100% of the time like Luka. Especially in transition, I think you're going to want Ivey to be the one pushing the ball up the court. And there will be times where it makes sense for Cade to get the ball off of a weakside screen so the defense isn't completely locked on him from the moment he crosses half court  all game - and vice versa for Ivey.

Good teams have multiple playmakers that can initiate the offense. Look at Boston, where Tatum's usage rate is 32.7 and Brown's is 31.4. Sure, you'll have Cade running the show in crunch time, but for the rest of the game you want to have multiple looks to throw at the opposition.

Also, to @gehringer_2's point, we need Casey out of here. The guy religiously runs a 5-in, 5-out lineup and can't figure out how to stagger. We've got to find a coach who can manage the simple task of keeping one of Cade and Ivey in the game at all times. That will allow each of them to run the show solo for about half of their on-court minutes.

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53 minutes ago, Betrayer said:

I hear the concern, but I don't think it's that black and white of an issue. Ivey has plenty of reps off-ball with Killian (or CoJo) running the point, so I think he's seeing both scenarios.

We also shouldn't expect Cade to initiate the offense 100% of the time like Luka. Especially in transition, I think you're going to want Ivey to be the one pushing the ball up the court. And there will be times where it makes sense for Cade to get the ball off of a weakside screen so the defense isn't completely locked on him from the moment he crosses half court  all game - and vice versa for Ivey.

Good teams have multiple playmakers that can initiate the offense. Look at Boston, where Tatum's usage rate is 32.7 and Brown's is 31.4. Sure, you'll have Cade running the show in crunch time, but for the rest of the game you want to have multiple looks to throw at the opposition.

Also, to @gehringer_2's point, we need Casey out of here. The guy religiously runs a 5-in, 5-out lineup and can't figure out how to stagger. We've got to find a coach who can manage the simple task of keeping one of Cade and Ivey in the game at all times. That will allow each of them to run the show solo for about half of their on-court minutes.

That's partially why I'm skeptical of the Ivey fit with Cade, because Casey doesn't know his head from his ass in terms of how to put his players in a position to succeed. He's the biggest deterrent to future Pistons success, Weaver needs to put loyalty and decide what's best for the team and go coach shopping this offseason.

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3 hours ago, NYLion said:

Yeah but my only problem is that this development could be stunted because he won't be running the team next season with Cade back (presumably). He's being deployed as the floor general now but will likely be more off ball with Cade back so I'm unsure of the fit long term.

I'm going to argue until I'm blue in the face...

Ivey should be primary ballhandler and initiate the offense, and Cade secondary when the ball swings out to him. 

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2 hours ago, Betrayer said:

I hear the concern, but I don't think it's that black and white of an issue. Ivey has plenty of reps off-ball with Killian (or CoJo) running the point, so I think he's seeing both scenarios.

We also shouldn't expect Cade to initiate the offense 100% of the time like Luka. Especially in transition, I think you're going to want Ivey to be the one pushing the ball up the court. And there will be times where it makes sense for Cade to get the ball off of a weakside screen so the defense isn't completely locked on him from the moment he crosses half court  all game - and vice versa for Ivey.

Good teams have multiple playmakers that can initiate the offense. Look at Boston, where Tatum's usage rate is 32.7 and Brown's is 31.4. Sure, you'll have Cade running the show in crunch time, but for the rest of the game you want to have multiple looks to throw at the opposition...

This.

The first part yes.

I'm not certain about the second part (which I deleted, so, really... just answering what I quoted).

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8 hours ago, Betrayer said:

Meanwhile, the Rookie of the Month is Paolo and his averages are:

16.6 PPG, 3.3 APG. 7.5 RPG, 37% FG, and 3% 3FG, on 45% TS

No, that's not a typo. He shot 3% (1 for 33) from 3 point range in February.

Yeah, shoulda been Kessler or Williams.  I wonder if Kessler has a shot at ROY over Paolo.  

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On 3/3/2023 at 11:31 AM, Betrayer said:

Meanwhile, the Rookie of the Month is Paolo and his averages are:

16.6 PPG, 3.3 APG. 7.5 RPG, 37% FG, and 3% 3FG, on 45% TS

No, that's not a typo. He shot 3% (1 for 33) from 3 point range in February.

Whoa, hold on, easy on throwing shade.  He made one more 3 than the rest of us morans did combined.

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