gehringer_2 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 (edited) 46 minutes ago, chasfh said: I don't have any sense that Mize is considered a golden child by Harris, and I would be frankly surprised to learn that Mize would go up and Olson down for that particular reason. One can never leave the owner out of all consideration when it comes to a sports team - just sayin' Consider a conversation like this between CI and SH: CI: so how are you going to decide on the rotation. They all look so close SH: they are, it's a tough call. But either way they will likely all pitch for us this season CI: If their performance is a wash, I think it would be good for the franchise to be able to spotlight the news of Casey's recovery SH: ?????? Is he gonna say no? Edited March 18 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 5 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: One can never leave the owner out of all consideration when it comes to a sports team - just sayin' I agree with this on its face, although I do think that Baby Doc has always been more hands off the team than Papa Doc was, and I also think that since he's come to Jesus about the Tigers, Baby Doc is more likely to allow the actual baseball people to make the decisions. I'd be more inclined to agree with you if there were a general clamoring by the fans and the press for Mize to make the team, but I honestly think Mize has been more or less forgotten about by the fans, as of today, and I don't see a movement afoot by the press to shill for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 1 minute ago, chasfh said: Mize has been more or less forgotten about by the fans, as of today, and I don't see a movement afoot by the press to shill for him. This is probably true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 Why not keep both and have them tandem start? The cost is only one more middle reliever in Toledo instead of Detroit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 Their choice will come down to which one they think needs to work on something more than the other one does to reach their peak, and it won't be a difficult one to make or to sell to the person. Or an injury could make it for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 It's kind of a good thing that there's too many options instead of not enough. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 21 minutes ago, Edman85 said: It's kind of a good thing that there's too many options instead of not enough. Its an unfamiliar feeling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 45 minutes ago, casimir said: Its an unfamiliar feeling. Even in the playoff years the number 5 and often number 4 starters were sort band aid and chewing gum guys. Pitchers you just hoped could avoid taxing the BP in the loss while you won a lopsided percentage of Verlander and Scherzer starts. The *apparent* starting depth for this team is pretty extraordinary - maybe we are too close to it to appreciate it. And of course injury could disappear it all in short order, which given recent history is probably what keeps us all from reaching any irrational exuberance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 1 hour ago, gehringer_2 said: Even in the playoff years the number 5 and often number 4 starters were sort band aid and chewing gum guys. Pitchers you just hoped could avoid taxing the BP in the loss while you won a lopsided percentage of Verlander and Scherzer starts. The *apparent* starting depth for this team is pretty extraordinary - maybe we are too close to it to appreciate it. And of course injury could disappear it all in short order, which given recent history is probably what keeps us all from reaching any irrational exuberance. That is not my recollection of 2012-2014. Not at all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 2 hours ago, Edman85 said: It's kind of a good thing that there's too many options instead of not enough. one could say there is no such thing as too many options when it comes to pitching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4hzglory Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 28 minutes ago, Edman85 said: That is not my recollection of 2012-2014. Not at all. Yeah, we had a great starting 5 the vast majority of the playoff run. It was the bullpen that was unpredictable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Edman85 said: That is not my recollection of 2012-2014. Not at all. some years were obviously better than others, but in the span from 2006 to 2014, reguar rotation starters for the Tigers in a season included: Nate Robertson, Zach Minor, Mike Maroth, Chad Durbin, Brad Penny, Phil Coke, Alfredo Simon, a few seasons of Rick Porcello during his disappearing fastball phase, and a highly disinterested version of David Price. I'd have loved to have Reese Olson in front of any of those guys. Edited March 18 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theroundsquare Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 48 minutes ago, Edman85 said: That is not my recollection of 2012-2014. Not at all. That is my recollection of 2011 with Brad Penny, maybe that is who gehringer_2 was thinking of Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 2012 and 13, you had some combo of Verlander, Scherzer, Porcello, Sanchez, and Fister with Smyly in reserve. 2014, Fister was traded, and Smyly backfilled until Price was acquired. That core was pretty durable. You had as good of a 1-5 as you will find in baseball history. Yes, they didn't make every start so you may remember some back end guys who filled in, but you are talking about your 7th and 8th guys not your 4th and 5th. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigermojo Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 2 minutes ago, Edman85 said: 2012 and 13, you had some combo of Verlander, Scherzer, Porcello, Sanchez, and Fister with Smyly in reserve. 2014, Fister was traded, and Smyly backfilled until Price was acquired. That core was pretty durable. You had as good of a 1-5 as you will find in baseball history. Yes, they didn't make every start so you may remember some back end guys who filled in, but you are talking about your 7th and 8th guys not your 4th and 5th. Have you done any projections for Toledo's roster like you did for the Tigers opening day roster? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 13 minutes ago, Tigermojo said: Have you done any projections for Toledo's roster like you did for the Tigers opening day roster? If you have my sheet bookmarked, yes. The whole system including cuts and 60 day IL spots to get down to 165. I just found out Huira's opt out today and may tweak later. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 In ‘14 I recall Verlander being the question mark. Wasn’t he battling nagging injuries? Didn’t appear to miss time but definitely an off year. Was that when he had core issues in ST? Led to some disagreements with the Tigers medical staff. Anthony Fenech was digging into it which led to a thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigermojo Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Edman85 said: If you have my sheet bookmarked, yes. The whole system including cuts and 60 day IL spots to get down to 165. I just found out Huira's opt out today and may tweak later. Can you post the link again please? Found it: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/1jRnDAcv86yGYl1Tq6fdXD1VoGr2Ls5PiRBNEFBXHL3Y/htmlview?pli=1# Edited March 18 by Tigermojo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 9 minutes ago, oblong said: In ‘14 I recall Verlander being the question mark. Wasn’t he battling nagging injuries? Didn’t appear to miss time but definitely an off year. Was that when he had core issues in ST? Led to some disagreements with the Tigers medical staff. Anthony Fenech was digging into it which led to a thing. right. Had the core surgery in Jan of '14, but came back and wasn't right. Went to the DL to start '15 supposedly with a tricep issue but Verlander later said he went to his own doc and the real issue was his back. Anyway after a poor finish is '15 he rehabbed differently in the off-season and was pretty much back in '16, but he still wasn't trusting his FB until '17 when he started throwing it up again, lowered his arm angle to where it had been in the past (he had raised it to try to recover ost velo during back and core issues) and by mid '17 he had pretty much recovered the full arsenal. There was a lot of talk about the slider improving in Houston, and maybe it did, it I've always believed it was recovery the classic Verlander fastball in/around May-June 17 before the trade that drove everything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 55 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: right. Had the core surgery in Jan of '14, but came back and wasn't right. Went to the DL to start '15 supposedly with a tricep issue but Verlander later said he went to his own doc and the real issue was his back. Anyway after a poor finish is '15 he rehabbed differently in the off-season and was pretty much back in '16, but he still wasn't trusting his FB until '17 when he started throwing it up again, lowered his arm angle to where it had been in the past (he had raised it to try to recover ost velo during back and core issues) and by mid '17 he had pretty much recovered the full arsenal. There was a lot of talk about the slider improving in Houston, and maybe it did, it I've always believed it was recovery the classic Verlander fastball in/around May-June 17 before the trade that drove everything else. Yes! That’s it. He should have won the CY in ‘16. In ‘17 he was just as good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 (edited) 2 hours ago, theroundsquare said: That is my recollection of 2011 with Brad Penny, maybe that is who gehringer_2 was thinking of I do remember Brad Penny, maybe Al Albequerque and some other random AAAA type as the only healthy & available arms for a playoff game one season. But it certainly wasn't 2012-2014. Edited March 18 by casimir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 59 minutes ago, casimir said: I do remember Brad Penny, maybe Al Albequerque and some other random AAAA type as the only healthy & available arms for a playoff game one season. But it certainly wasn't 2012-2014. You might be thinking of the time Freddy Garcia pitched in a makeup game with the white sox on a Monday after the season ended that had a playoff feel to it. They needed to win it to force a one game playoff with MN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 12 minutes ago, oblong said: You might be thinking of the time Freddy Garcia pitched in a makeup game with the white sox on a Monday after the season ended that had a playoff feel to it. They needed to win it to force a one game playoff with MN. Ah, yes, the Freddy Garcia era. Good times, all 5 or whatever games he pitched for the Tigers. That makeup game sucked. I remember it, I watched it as though it were a penance from confession. But Brad Penny did start a playoff game against Texas in 2011. He lasted all of 1 2/3 innings. I don’t remember exactly what the issue was, but the pitching staff was beset with issues that series. Injuries, ineffectiveness. I’m pretty sure Penny was relegated to the bullpen for the series, but got pulled back to the rotation out of desperation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 1 hour ago, casimir said: I do remember Brad Penny, maybe Al Albequerque and some other random AAAA type as the only healthy & available arms for a playoff game one season. But it certainly wasn't 2012-2014. no doubt 12-14 was pretty good, but 'playoff period' takes me back all the way to '06. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 2 hours ago, gehringer_2 said: right. Had the core surgery in Jan of '14, but came back and wasn't right. Went to the DL to start '15 supposedly with a tricep issue but Verlander later said he went to his own doc and the real issue was his back. Anyway after a poor finish is '15 he rehabbed differently in the off-season and was pretty much back in '16, but he still wasn't trusting his FB until '17 when he started throwing it up again, lowered his arm angle to where it had been in the past (he had raised it to try to recover ost velo during back and core issues) and by mid '17 he had pretty much recovered the full arsenal. There was a lot of talk about the slider improving in Houston, and maybe it did, it I've always believed it was recovery the classic Verlander fastball in/around May-June 17 before the trade that drove everything else. He replied to my tweet clarify. Anyways, that was his lat, and I always struggle when people try to say the lat is a back muscle and not as shoulder muscle. I mean, it is a back muscle, but it connects to the shoulder. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.