2021 Postseason thread

[1984Echoes]

12 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

the Tigers spent a lot of money on expensive players but I still never had the feeling there was ever any plan wrt producing a team where the pieces actually fit together. I think it's completely fair to critique Avila on how long it took him to get the decks cleared and actually begin rebuilding, but I at least do now have the feeling that Avila has a clear concept of what the team his is trying to build looks like and when he make moves they move in that direction and not at random angles to it. That's not enough by itself, but it's one piece that used to be lacking that I give him credit for today.

Draft and Develop.

We'll see over the next few years how good he is at that. And if the Org is doing that proficiently. 

And for several years after that whether what he built is sustainable, and sustains the Tigers as a winning team, over the next 10 years. It's what I expected from Dombrowski (history of that with the 80's White Sox, early 90's Expos, and late 90's Marlins) but we never got. As outlined by you, above.

Also, it still looks like Hinch is a major linchpin in the future success of our Draft & Develop strategy. From the MLB level, and down.

[1984Echoes]

8 minutes ago, chasfh said:

... I have to wonder how much of it will have been Avila’s doing, and how much of it is due to Hinch coming on board. Because as much credit as it is fair give Avila for bringing on Hinch in the first place, practically none of the things the organization has done that we’ve been raving about happened before Hinch got here.

I think that's not fair to Avila.

He did draft and develop Turnbull, did draft and develop Matt Manning, he did put in analytics prior to Hinch arriving, he did trade for Candelario/ Rogers/ Cameron/ Wentz, etc., he did find guys out of nowhere like Baddoo/ Cisnero/ Haase, etc...

Now I believe Hinch is a huge linchpin that makes everything work. He gets credit for that. And for making the Tigers an (almost .500) winning team, because he can apply concepts at the MLB-level team and, hopefully, that filters downward. But I have maintained this all along, and especially saw it early this season: I think this board is hugely unfair to Al Avila.

He built this team, and the current organization/ philosophy/ etc. Including hiring Hinch.

And Hinch? He makes it all work. So yes, he is invaluable... and potentially in the future, more valuable than AA (if not already).

But Avila deserves credit.

[oblong]

The things they are doing well now in the FO were put in place years ago.  Brad Ausmus of all people talked about it when he left.  He specifically said it will still take 3-4 years for it to come to fruition.  It's not just strategy and philosophy but physical systems and databases that have to be built.

I don't believe the Tigers in the DD era had any specific plan. They didn't set out to build around SP and a few big bats.   DD saw a deal or a player he wanted and made it.   Because teams have typically 5 SP then there's more of them to out there to acquire.  A good 2B or 3B will cost more than a prospect no matter how touted they are. 

The lack of development hurt them because they had to sign guys like Fielder and VMart (his 2nd contract) and overpay for Zimmerman.   

I like to fantasize that the Tigers signed Beltre prior to the 2011 season instead of VMart.

 

[Jim Cowan]

Avila built the current roster, 100%.  It's fair to complain about how long it took, but the positive trend and the players acquired over the past 3 years are entirely because of Avila and his evolving staff, and have nothing to do with the on-field coaching personnel.  Will Hinch be consulted about acquisitions?  Of course.  But those players would be here now, with him or without him.