Trumps Presidency 2025

[gehringer_2]

23 minutes ago, pfife said:

Jeez that 'since 2003' wpuld include the great recession.   Thats spectacularly bad.

The headline sentence appears to just be wrong. He's actually excepting years in actual recession (2008,2009,2020). Sort of saying "the worst year except for the ones that were even worser."  Worst non-recession year since 2003 is still saying a lot though. Another example of how GDP, which is what defines recessions, is not really coupled to the economic outcome for most workers anymore.

Edited 5 hours ago by gehringer_2

[pfife]

10 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

The headline sentence appears to just be wrong. He's actually excepting years in actual recession (2008,2009,2020). Sort of saying "the worst year except for the ones that were even worser."  Worst non-recession year since 2003 is still saying a lot though. Another example of how GDP, which is what defines recessions, is not really coupled to the economic outcome for most workers anymore.

I see what you're saying thanks for pointing that out.

[Motown Bombers]

1 hour ago, gehringer_2 said:

The headline sentence appears to just be wrong. He's actually excepting years in actual recession (2008,2009,2020). Sort of saying "the worst year except for the ones that were even worser."  Worst non-recession year since 2003 is still saying a lot though. Another example of how GDP, which is what defines recessions, is not really coupled to the economic outcome for most workers anymore.

Essentially the worst since the last time Republicans were in office. 

[1984Echoes]

20 hours ago, pfife said:

candidate a:  has chance to win, supports policy that voter thinks would result in death of spouse within 2 years.

candidate b:  has chance to win, supports policy that voter thinks would result in death of spouse within 2 years, but country would be better.

candidate c :   has no chance to win, but explicitly does not support policy that voter things would result in death of spouse within 2 years. 

...

Did Joe Biden support a policy that would kill your spouse?

Because Trump sure supports a LOT of policies that will kill a LOT of spouses.

[guy incognito]

[Tiger337]

A real example of what I think PFife is talking about (I think):

There are a LOT of people (including very smarts ones) who think that we are screwed whether we have a democracy, a dictatorship or something in between because of global warming.  They think that neither party comes close to addressing the issue in a meaningful way.  Why should they vote for either party?  I'm not really with them because I don't know enough about it to know how bad it's going to get or how, so I vote for a democracy.  However, if I shared their dire views, I sure wouldn't worry about our form of government over the world surviving.   

Edited 1 hour ago by Tiger337

[gehringer_2]

3 minutes ago, Tiger337 said:

A real example of what I think PFife is talking about (I think):

There are a LOT of people (including very smarts ones) who think that we are screwed whether we have a democracy, a dictatorship or something in between because of global warming.  They think that neither party comes close to addressing the issue in a meaningful way.  Why should they vote for either party?  I'm not really with them because I don't know enough about it to know how bad it's going to get or how, so I vote for a democracy.  However, if I shared their dire views, I sure wouldn't worry about our form of government over the world surviving.   

I don't have any trouble understanding people who feel participating in the system is pointless.  I don't agree with the sentiment but I understand it. And for those people, I can't say I see the point of voting 3rd party either (or voting at all FTM), not from any political angle in this case but just that it's a pure waste  of their time to participate at all if they believe the system is irredeemable. Which ties back to the idea of casting a pointless vote as some kind of private  protest or ego gratification. Maybe it makes someone feel like they have poked the system in eye, but the system doesn't feel a thing and doesn't care.

What the discussion here focuses on for me is the practical value of various voting strategies once one has decided they do care about the process/outcome.

[Tiger337]

1 minute ago, gehringer_2 said:

I don't have any trouble understanding people who feel participating in the system is pointless.  I don't agree with the sentiment but I understand it. And for those people, I can't say I see the point of voting 3rd party either (or voting at all FTM), not from any political angle in this case but just that it's a pure waste  of their time to participate at all if they believe the system is irredeemable. Which ties back to the idea of casting a pointless vote as some kind of private  protest or ego gratification. Maybe it makes someone feel like they have poked the system in eye, but the system doesn't feel a thing and doesn't care.

What the discussion here focuses on for me is the practical value of various voting strategies once one has decided they do care about the process/outcome.

Perhaps, it is the hope that they can start some kind of momentum.  Ross Perot got 19% of the vote in 1992.  That's a lot votes.  It didn't go anywhere, but perhaps the right person in the right time could change that. 

[gehringer_2]

1 minute ago, Tiger337 said:

Perhaps, it is the hope that they can start some kind of momentum.  Ross Perot got 19% of the vote in 1992.  That's a lot votes.  It didn't go anywhere, but perhaps the right person in the right time could change that. 

Yeah - There might have been enough voter sentiment to get a third party going at that point but Ross wasn't really interested in building a movement, he just wanted to be President. I tend to think if a new party takes hold - probably eventually displacing one of the main ones, it will start local, become a established presence in a few states first, then organize nationally once they have an established constituency. I don't see the likelihood of a viable new party coming out of independent Presidential bids.

[oblong]

To me voting third party is like signing a “change.org” petition or wearing a ribbon for cancer or whatever. 

[pfife]

2 hours ago, 1984Echoes said:

Did Joe Biden support a policy that would kill your spouse

No