2023 WBC Tournament

[RandyMarsh]

2 on nobody out to start the 7 for US and Trout proceeds to hit a lazy pop out and then Goldschmidt hits in to a double play to end the threat. Same old Tige...I mean USA.

[RandyMarsh]

Schwarber crushes one off Darvish to make it a 1 run game now in the 8th. 

[CMRivdogs]

You couldn't have scripted this game any better...

[RandyMarsh]

3 minutes ago, CMRivdogs said:

You couldn't have scripted this game any better...

Ohtani strikes out Trout to give Japan the Championship. Two teammates, arguably the two most well known and best players in baseball face off for the final out. Yep couldn't have scripted it better!

[holygoat]

That was like a movie ending that you'd roll your eyes at for being cheesy as hell. Unreal.

[RandyMarsh]

BTW in that final AB Ohtani blows 101 by Trout, then 102 in the dirt, blows another 101 by him and finishes him off with a slider/cutter that nobody in the history of baseball could've hit. Just absolute filthy stuff. 

Edited March 22, 2023 by RandyMarsh

[RandyMarsh]

BTW Ohtani had the single highest pitch velocity and exit velocity in the entire tournament. 

[SoCalTiger]

And as of now Ohtani has passed Trout as the games best player. Not surprised Japan won given their balance of pitching-hitting- fielding. I really enjoyed that tournament and hope the Tigers can soon play meaningful games.

[lordstanley]

9 hours ago, SoCalTiger said:

And as of now Ohtani has passed Trout as the games best player. Not surprised Japan won given their balance of pitching-hitting- fielding. I really enjoyed that tournament and hope the Tigers can soon play meaningful games.

My middle-aged sister in law in Taiwan, a casual baseball fan at most, knew everything about Ohtani. He is not only a megastar In Japan but also a household name in Taiwan and Korea. 

[lordstanley]

11 hours ago, holygoat said:

That was like a movie ending that you'd roll your eyes at for being cheesy as hell. Unreal.

Except to Mets and Astros fans, the WBC has to be considered a resounding success. 

[oblong]

It was so fun to watch.  I wonder how it feels to the players?  The US players looked dejected and the damn season hasn't started yet.

And we watched all of that without a pitch clock.  Yes I'm beating that drum still.  I am close to saying I don't like it.

 

[gehringer_2]

49 minutes ago, oblong said:

It was so fun to watch.  I wonder how it feels to the players?  The US players looked dejected and the damn season hasn't started yet.

And we watched all of that without a pitch clock.  Yes I'm beating that drum still.  I am close to saying I don't like it.

 

yeah - there is a certain level of relaxation in watching a BB game that is lost since you constantly feel the time pressure on the pitcher. I think they had to do something but now that I see it in action I might have approached it differently:

1) yes make the batter step in within 8 seconds and stay in the box. Nobody gains anything watching a batter adjust velcro - that had to go.

2) give the pitcher as long as he wants but after 20 seconds the batter has to be given time by the ump IF he asks for it. Once a batter has stepped out on a pitch once, then the pitcher MUST deliver in 15 sec once the batter returns. I think once you break pitchers of the ability to take a long time on that second pitch, they will probably get out of the habit of taking a long time on the 1st one as well because they are not going to want to work at mulitple rhythms. The system ends up becoming pretty self regulating intead of clock watching based. It does shift control to the hitter - as long as he is willing to wait before stepping out there is no clock running - but that will be most of the time I think.

The truth is that other than some relievers, most pitchers prefer to work on a pace - it's the batters that were screwing up the game with all the step outs and glove adjustments - so the requirement on the pitchers were probably largely misguided. There are some relievers that were terrible and the modern idea of holding a pitch forever to freeze a runner had to be stopped, but making the pitcher come home in ~15 after you've exhausted the hitter's patience once might have been enough.

Edited March 22, 2023 by gehringer_2

[oblong]

CJ with the same thoughts.  He clocks the final at bat.  If someone thinks this needs improving then I am not sure the they are baseball fan and why are we making rules for non baseball fan.  There's a middle ground somewhere in all of this.

 

 

[SoCalTiger]

1 hour ago, lordstanley said:

My middle-aged sister in law in Taiwan, a casual baseball fan at most, knew everything about Ohtani. He is not only a megastar In Japan but also a household name in Taiwan and Korea. 

Yes I also have friends and family in Taiwan who love Ohtani and of course my Japanese customers are going Banzai today. I am lucky that both he and Trout are only a short drive for me to see. Great tournament.

[SoCalTiger]

27 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

yeah - there is a certain level of relaxation in watching a BB game that is lost since you constantly feel the time pressure on the pitcher. I think they had to do something but now that I see it in action I might have approached it differently:

1) yes make the batter step in within 8 seconds and stay in the box. Nobody gains anything watching a batter adjust velcro - that had to go.

2) give the pitcher as long as he wants but after 20 seconds the batter has to be given time by the ump IF he asks for it. Once a batter has stepped out on a pitch once, then the pitcher MUST deliver in 15 sec once the batter returns. I think once you break pitchers of the ability to take a long time on that second pitch, they will probably get out of the habit of taking a long time on the 1st one as well because they are not going to want to work at mulitple rhythms. The system ends up becoming pretty self regulating intead of clock watching based. It does shift control to the hitter - as long as he is willing to wait before stepping out there is no clock running - but that will be most of the time I think.

The truth is that other than some relievers, most pitchers prefer to work on a pace - it's the batters that were screwing up the game with all the step outs and glove adjustments - so the requirement on the pitchers were probably largely misguided. There are some relievers that were terrible and the modern idea of holding a pitch forever to freeze a runner had to be stopped, but making the pitcher come home in ~15 after you've exhausted the hitter's patience once might have been enough.

All good ideas. I think they might just adjust the time to 10- 12 seconds for the batter and 20 for the pitcher for all situations. Overall I like it but it seems just a bit rushed.

[oblong]

I don't think the goal is to stop what we saw last night.  It's to stop the situations that "we know it when we see it".... constant adjusting of gloves and pacing around the mound.  Basically any Red Sox/Yankee game.

 

[casimir]

2 hours ago, oblong said:

CJ with the same thoughts.  He clocks the final at bat.  If someone thinks this needs improving then I am not sure the they are baseball fan and why are we making rules for non baseball fan.  There's a middle ground somewhere in all of this.

 

 

I agree, I think in close & late situations, the clock should be discarded.  That is one caveat that I wish would have been built into the rule.  And maybe there will be enough discussion about it that they will edit it a bit.

[Tigeraholic1]

I thought I saw Manfred is suppose to make a few rule modifications before the season?

[gehringer_2]

a problem with a blanket move like waiving it late is that you would still have relievers that never picked up the discipline of working faster. That's sort of where I see they could improve it. Set up a system where guys are forced to work faster at least enough that it becomes a habit, and then you can relax it under some circumstances to benefit tension and the game still is not likely to slow to a crawl, but if you do something that exempts certain guys completely - for instance like closers, you won't 'reform' their behavior at all.

Edited March 22, 2023 by gehringer_2

[oblong]

I think extending it instead of waiving it would be good.  That example alone shows a 25/30 range is still acceptable.  I watched that clip numerous times and never felt like it was dragging.  Especially when you give the broadcast time to review the previous pitch.

I think 25/30 forces the problem relieves to adjust their game.

[gehringer_2]

15 minutes ago, oblong said:

I think extending it instead of waiving it would be good.  That example alone shows a 25/30 range is still acceptable.  I watched that clip numerous times and never felt like it was dragging.  Especially when you give the broadcast time to review the previous pitch.

I think 25/30 forces the problem relieves to adjust their game.

Manning with a  move Dan hadn't seen yet during the game today. Against a batter that had already stepped out and with a runner on base, he came ready very early on the clock so he had more than 10 sec and then did an old fashioned hold for over 7 sec to freeze the runner and the batter could not take time. Clever boy.

Edited March 22, 2023 by gehringer_2

[CMRivdogs]

17 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

Manning with a  move Dan hadn't seen yet during the game today. Against a batter that had already stepped out and with a runner on base, he came ready very early on the clock so he had more than 10 sec and then did an old fashioned hold for over 7 sec to freeze the runner and the batter could not take time. Clever boy.

Early in the pre-season I saw an interview with Max Scherzer who talked about experimenting with ways to keep the batter off guard. That was one of them. If you're good enough to mix up your timing...

 

[holygoat]

8 hours ago, oblong said:

It was so fun to watch.  I wonder how it feels to the players?  The US players looked dejected and the damn season hasn't started yet.

And we watched all of that without a pitch clock.  Yes I'm beating that drum still.  I am close to saying I don't like it.

 

I dig the pitch clock. A game like last night's doesn't seem to drag because there is constant level of intensity that won't exist in most regular season games.  

[gehringer_2]

3 hours ago, CMRivdogs said:

Early in the pre-season I saw an interview with Max Scherzer who talked about experimenting with ways to keep the batter off guard. That was one of them. If you're good enough to mix up your timing...

 

LOL - not much gets past Max

[Edman85]

9 hours ago, oblong said:

It was so fun to watch.  I wonder how it feels to the players?  The US players looked dejected and the damn season hasn't started yet.

And we watched all of that without a pitch clock.  Yes I'm beating that drum still.  I am close to saying I don't like it.

 

Wait til you attend your first game, stay til the end, get home and get to bed on time.