motownblues Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 So tell me, what the hell happened?can't be just the Larkin injury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 (edited) I just watched the Tigers game. Am not going to lose the buzz from Jackson Jobe's debut to flip over to the rest of this one. 2nd year in a row the team has collapsed at about this time of year. Very different circumstances but same result. Edited March 12 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slothfacekilla Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 Well it was nice to have playoff hopes for a bit this season I guess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motownblues Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 I would hope to believe that Yzerman doesn't have to start all over again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 alex lyon was carrying them. he has now turned back into alex lyon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hongbit Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 It’s not Alex Lyon’s fault. It’s Priority Trash’s fault. For the love of god, just give them their money back and take the trash patch off the sweater. This is the hockey gods punishment for Chris defacing one of the most iconic jerseys in sports. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 14 minutes ago, buddha said: alex lyon was carrying them. he has now turned back into alex lyon. I believe that was the fear two weeks ago. It's come home to roost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 this is quite an epic collapse. at some point you do have to look at the coaching staff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 12 minutes ago, buddha said: this is quite an epic collapse. at some point you do have to look at the coaching staff. Or Lalonde had them playing over their talent level to begin with and they have come back to reality. I question some of his line decisions, but that's a lot like questioning Jim Leyland's bullpen management. Hard to be critical when he never had one to manage. This team is woefully short of players that can drive possession on both ends. For a while it looked like Ras might turn into one, but his level of play isn't high enough over all. Veleno is also a bust in that regard. Maybe the best thing the team could have done would have been to get Seider a stud stay at home defender to play with and turn him loose to play a full 200 ft game - but they went in exactly the opposite direction this year -making him the stay at home guy. His skating and puck handling skill may be being wasted with that strategy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motor City Sonics Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 What a weak bunch this team is. Their leader goes out and they quit. The flat-out quit. I question it all at this point. How many more years do we have to wait, Yzerman? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motor City Sonics Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 37 minutes ago, buddha said: this is quite an epic collapse. at some point you do have to look at the coaching staff. not just that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordstanley Posted March 13 Author Share Posted March 13 0-6 after starting 2024 at 16-4-2. How do you lose 6 straight games in the NHL, not even picking up loser points?! When that stretch includes NYI at home, at Arizona and at Buffalo. 4 of the 6 losses have been blowouts. I'm struggling to recall a bigger meltdown by a decent Detroit sports team (I'm not talking about losing stretches by lousy Detroit sports teams, we've seen plenty of that the past 10 years). Yes, epic collapse is right, that's for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 (edited) 2 hours ago, motownblues said: So tell me, what the hell happened?can't be just the Larkin injury. 1 hour ago, motownblues said: I would hope to believe that Yzerman doesn't have to start all over again. No... there's no "start over". This team just isn't good enough yet. I mean, they're good, there's lots of positives, Stevie's been adding depth guys for at least the past 2 years... But we're sifting through goalies and nothing has stuck yet. Nedeljkovic was a nice try and had some good games, but didn't cut it with the Wings (needed better D in front of him)... Husso was a nice try and had some good games with the Wings but currently is faltering with the Wings (looks like he needs better health and better D in front of him)... Lyon is explained really well right here: 1 hour ago, buddha said: alex lyon was carrying them. he has now turned back into alex lyon. In other words: Lyon looks like he needs better D in front of him. (It's sort of a theme with the Wings... and on all 5 guys too... not just on 2...) I think we just need some more of these young kids who look like they have some really high skill level to make their way to the Wings. That would include Edvinsson (better D, of course), Cossa (a #1 in goal instead of tossing #2 guys out there and hoping they turn into a #1...), Kasper. Just for starters. This team needs more high-end talent. And I don't know if any of these guys are ready yet. We have a lot of guys who are adding depth to this team. But they are all flawed, limited, whatever term you want to use. They add goals or playmaking (Sprong & Gostisbehere as examples), but their flaws cannot always be hidden. Could go through almost every player and do the same thing: List a positive or two, and then the negatives. The team played together really well this season and the "sum was definitely greater than the parts". But IMO... this team needs a higher skill level, and a higher "drive-to-win" level players, to become a sustainable playoff team. Larkin can drive this team to wins. And...? That's what I mean in a nutshell. The depth and the "sum-of-the-parts" means we're close to a playoff team. But apparently, just not quite there yet. I still believe this team needs to add more "drivers" to get wins. So... sorry to annoy everyone, I also think that takes looking at a guy or two on Lindholm & Hanifan's level. Not necessarily the superstar or even Larkin-level guys... but hard-nosed/ high skill players just a cut below Larkin that can ALSO drive a team to compete, overall, at a higher level. And face adversity & overcome it. And if Larkin gets knocked out for a week every now-and-then (this IS the NHL after all...), these other guys can still push the rest of the team to... not completely fall on their asses like they have the past 6 games? Yeeesh! Just my 2 cents. Edited March 13 by 1984Echoes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 I'll add one more thing: "Playoff level toughness". I don't think we have it. Not last year and not this year, at least the past 6 games. Which could be the need for better players... as I've outlined above... Or... Could be coaching as others have mentioned above. I don't know the answer to that one. Could be both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motownblues Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 14 hours ago, 1984Echoes said: I'll add one more thing: "Playoff level toughness". I don't think we have it. Not last year and not this year, at least the past 6 games. Which could be the need for better players... as I've outlined above... Or... Could be coaching as others have mentioned above. I don't know the answer to that one. Could be both. I look back on when Illitch brought in Devallano and then they drafted Yzerman. It took 13 years to win the cup. Granted, the organization was in much worse shape then than it was when Yzerman took over. Just hope it's not going to be 13 years to rebuild again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordstanley Posted March 13 Author Share Posted March 13 1 hour ago, motownblues said: I look back on when Illitch brought in Devallano and then they drafted Yzerman. It took 13 years to win the cup. Granted, the organization was in much worse shape then than it was when Yzerman took over. Just hope it's not going to be 13 years to rebuild again. But in Devellano's second season ('83-'84) the Wings made the playoffs (granted, super easy back then to do) and in his 5th and 6th seasons they made the conference finals. Sure, those teams were weaker than typical conference finals teams, but the '88 team (6th season) did go 41-28-11 in the regular season for 93 points in an era before OT and shootouts. This is Yzerman's 5th season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.TaterSalad Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 17 hours ago, buddha said: this is quite an epic collapse. at some point you do have to look at the coaching staff. And the GM who put this team together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordstanley Posted March 13 Author Share Posted March 13 Just now, Mr.TaterSalad said: And the GM who put this team together. I'm going to wait until the end of season because I honestly don't know how to judge this team right now. 13-7-3 start into early December had been optimistic. Then 3-8-1 stretch was depressing, thank God for the Wings that the Lions and Wolverines were keeping everyone distracted. Then, it's like they shook that off as just an anomaly and went 16-4-2 to start 2024, which is 1/4 of the season playing as a top 5 team, or 3/4 of the season being 11th overall. Then Larkin gets hurt and instead of digging extra deep, you'd think, to show that wouldn't derail them like it did in December they have completed collapsed with an embarrassing 6-game losing streak. A tale of four mini-seasons. Let's see how final 17 games of the season. If they make the playoffs, even as 8th seed, I'll be satisfied with progress. If they miss, even as 9th seed, both Yzerman and Lalonde (Yzerman's hire of course) need to start feeling the heat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 1 hour ago, Mr.TaterSalad said: And the GM who put this team together. when they hired yzerman, i posted "how long will it take for tater to call for him to be fired?" i guess now we know. a six game losing streak in year 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 they were the worst team in the history of modern hockey with a barren farm system. ken holland says it takes ten years to rebuild? imo, the rebuild started when holland was fired. everything he did before then to get assets was ok, but then you had ken holland picking the assets. i have plenty of issues with what yzerman did this last offseason, most specifically loading up on old defensemen, but other than that i dont. i would give it a couple more years, but im patient. lol. and i think the wings had the worst organization in the league when he took over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.TaterSalad Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 1 minute ago, buddha said: when they hired yzerman, i posted "how long will it take for tater to call for him to be fired?" i guess now we know. a six game losing streak in year 5. Did I use the word fired? I must have missed that. But 5 years in and we have 0 playoff appearances with back-to-back end of season collapses. On top of that, we have no goaltending depth and are burning out the one guy we have in Lyon. We have signings not working out or underperforming and a coach whose got them stuck in neutral right now. I am by no means calling for anyone, Yzerman or Lalonde. But this isn't good hockey this team is playing. One guy going down for a couple of weeks shouldn't completely torpedo a season like this, but we've seen it now on a couple of occasions that it does. They look like a team that even if they did squeak into the playoffs somehow would be run right over and swept. I saw the growth from years 1 and 2 to where we are now. Where is the next step to get to even being a solid middle of the pack playoff team and what are the moves to get us there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 10 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said: ... But 5 years in and we have 0 playoff appearances with back-to-back end of season collapses. On top of that, we have no goaltending depth and are burning out the one guy we have in Lyon. We have signings not working out or underperforming and a coach whose got them stuck in neutral right now. I am ... That all changes in one year. With Yzerman at the helm. It's called a "rebuild", and it requires patience. That sucks big time... but... it still requires patience, whether any of us likes that or not. Most particularly because drafted hockey kids often take at least a few years to break into the NHL (even though there are some exceptions), and then STILL take a couple more years to make significant impacts towards the playoffs (for most at least)... AND... you cannot rebuild a bad team with no farm back into a "Playoff-Level Team" with ONLY 1st rounders. It takes LOTS of moves and... after Yzerman has made "lots" of moves, including draftees, trades, and FA signings, to get us to this point (hanging onto the edge of the playoffs but maybe not quite there yet), it's obvious he still has to make a few more (moves). But it's not like we are SO FAR AWAY (dire straits), we are, in fact... "ALMOST THERE" (nice song by anika noni rose) 10 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said: ... Where is the next step to get to even being a solid middle of the pack playoff team and what are the moves to get us there? I already outlined that above. See my earlier post above... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 Hindsight is 20/20 but objectively, we knew/should have know that Lyon was too big a part of the surge after the 1st of the year and that it was not sustainable, in which case I wish Yzerman had done some selling to obtain more future assets. Maybe he tried, no way to know. Stevie is a tight lipped as any GM in the history of major sports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 1 hour ago, gehringer_2 said: Hindsight is 20/20 but objectively, we knew/should have know that Lyon was too big a part of the surge after the 1st of the year and that it was not sustainable, in which case I wish Yzerman had done some selling to obtain more future assets. Maybe he tried, no way to know. Stevie is a tight lipped as any GM in the history of major sports. looking at what the market was doing, i dont think the wings had anything they were willing to give up that other teams wanted. i doubt you coukd get more than a 3rd for ghost or perron. if that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 2 hours ago, buddha said: looking at what the market was doing, i dont think the wings had anything they were willing to give up that other teams wanted. i doubt you coukd get more than a 3rd for ghost or perron. if that. I was hoping they would move a Dman just so we could get to see Edvinsson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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