Week Eleven: Detroit Lions (3-6) @ New York Giants (7-2)

[MichiganCardinal]

          vs.          

Setting: 11/20/2022 1:00pm EST on FOX

Site: MetLife Stadium in East Rutherford, NJ

Weather: 44° High, 22° Low, 35% chance of rain, 11mph Wind

Opening Spread: Giants -4

All-Time Series Record: Lions lead, 24-21-1

Last Meeting: 10/27/2019, Giants won 31-26

 

New York Giants (7-2)

Head Coach: Brian Daboll (1st Season: 7-2)

Projected Starting QB: Daniel Jones (4th Season: 19-26)

Last Week: 24-16 W v. Houston Texans (1-7-1)

Looking Ahead to Week #12: Thanksgiving @ Dallas Cowboys (6-3)

 

Your Detroit Lions (3-6)

Head Coach: Dan Campbell (2nd Season: 6-19-1)

Projected Starting QB: Jared Goff (7th Season: 48-43-1)

Last Week: 31-30 W @ Chicago Bears (3-7)

Looking Ahead to Week #12: Thanksgiving v. Buffalo Bills (6-3)

 

Elsewhere in the NFL

Primetime: Titans @ Packers (TNF), Chiefs @ Chargers (SNF), 49ers @ Cardinals (MNF)

1:00pm: Panthers @ Ravens, Bears @ Falcons, Browns @ Bills, Commanders @ Texans, Eagles @ Colts, Jets @ Patriots, Rams @ Saints

4:05/4:25pm: Raiders @ Broncos, Cowboys @ Vikings, Bengals @ Steelers

BYE: Jacksonville Jaguars, Seattle Seahawks, Miami Dolphins, Tampa Bay Buccaneers

[Motown Bombers]

Campbell and Holmes should be on the hot seat if they lose but shouldn't win a meaningless game because of draft picks.

[RandyMarsh]

Perhaps a meaningless tidbit but the Lions next 5 games are played exclusively at Ford Field or Met Life Stadium(1 at NYG and 1 at NYJ). Don't play a game outside of those two venues until Christmas Eve. 

[MichiganCardinal]

44 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

Perhaps a meaningless tidbit but the Lions next 5 games are played exclusively at Ford Field or Met Life Stadium(1 at NYG and 1 at NYJ). Don't play a game outside of those two venues until Christmas Eve. 

Sounds like we are heading straight for seven straight wins and a wildcard berth for Christmas, right??

[buddha]

still on schedule for 7 wins!  

[Hongbit]

The records mean nothing.  They are they exact opposite schedule wise with the Giants playing one of the easiest and the Lions one of the hardest.    These are probably two evenly matched teams.  
 

Two weeks in a row the Lions have made plays to win games at the very end.  That’s a good sign that maybe things are coming together.  
 

3 in a row heading into Thanksgiving would really be something.   

[Motown Bombers]

God I hope they beat the Giants so we can stop this what about the Giants.

[RandyMarsh]

I read an article last week that showed several analytics that pointed to the Giants being the worst 6-2 team in NFL history, considering they didnt exactly dominate a 1 win Texan team Id imagine that holds true with 7-2. 

[djhutch]

It would be really nice if the Lions blew somebody out once.

[Motor City Sonics]

I can see it now   -  Kenny Golladay - 14 catches, 264 yards..................

[Mr.TaterSalad]

2 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:

I read an article last week that showed several analytics that pointed to the Giants being the worst 6-2 team in NFL history, considering they didnt exactly dominate a 1 win Texan team Id imagine that holds true with 7-2. 

I'd be interested in seeing what indicates they are the worst 6-2 team ever. They have two marquee wins this year of division leading teams, having beaten Baltimore and Tennessee. If the Giants went out and only padded their stats and got wins over bottom feeders I'd be inclined to believe that. But they have two big wins this season.

[RandyMarsh]

49 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

I'd be interested in seeing what indicates they are the worst 6-2 team ever. They have two marquee wins this year of division leading teams, having beaten Baltimore and Tennessee. If the Giants went out and only padded their stats and got wins over bottom feeders I'd be inclined to believe that. But they have two big wins this season.

The Tennessee game was week 1 which is the most volatile week in the NFL so whether fair or not people don't put as much stock into those wins as others. Also Tennessee was short handed yet controlled most of the game, the Giants needed a late comeback to win by 1, again those are things analytics looks at, if you are getting beat for 50 out of the 60 minutes that is going to go against you. 

The Ravens game was even more lopsided, the Ravens controlled that game and had almost double the total yards, again it took a late comeback to win by 1 in a game they were getting beat the vast majority of the time. 

Yes the final score is all that matters but it doesn't always paint the picture on who was the better team majority of the game and in the Giants sake most of their wins have been those type which is why the metrics were so down on them. 

Edited November 14, 2022 by RandyMarsh

[RandyMarsh]

4 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

The Tennessee game was week 1 which is the most volatile week in the NFL so whether fair or not people don't put as much stock into those wins as others. Also Tennessee was short handed yet controlled most of the game, the Giants needed a late comeback to win by 1, again those are things analytics looks at, if you are getting beat for 50 out of the 60 minutes that is going to go against you. 

The Ravens game was even more lopsided, the Ravens controlled that game and had almost double the total yards, again it took a late comeback to win by 1 in a game they were getting beat the vast majority of the time. 

Yes the final score is all that matters but it doesn't always paint the picture on who was the better team majority of the game and in the Giants sake most of their wins have been those type which is why the metrics were so down on them. 

Also on top of this they only have a plus 14 margin despite the soft schedule and 7-2 record and most amazingly have given up more yards, more 1st downs, more yards per play and more time of possession to the opponents. Losing all those stats normally means you're a losing team, not a 7-2 one.

[buddha]

hutch v thibs.

this is (another) big game for the lions.  the giants have a great record but we all think they've been a bit lucky and have had an easier schedule.

a lion win here - on the road - would be a big sign that they might actually be turning a very small corner.

that said, saquon probably goes off and the lions will lose by two tuddies because, well, theyre the lions.

[Tigeraholic1]

Hearing practice window for Jaymo opens today....

[RedRamage]

1 hour ago, Tigeraholic1 said:

Hearing practice window for Jaymo opens today....

I wouldm't mind seeing him in a few games this year so he gets some NFL experience, but don't rush him.

[Motown Bombers]

Just make sure Williams is healthy and ready to go for the playoffs. 

[MichiganCardinal]

20 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Just make sure Williams is healthy and ready to go for the playoffs. 

Will need him for the 2v7 game against the Vikings.

[Motown Bombers]

1 minute ago, MichiganCardinal said:

Will need him for the 2v7 game against the Vikings.

It will be a must win for Campbell but the Lions also need to lose for draft position since the Hockenson compensation is tied to whether Minnesota wins a playoff game. 

[Mr.TaterSalad]

I think Campbell beating the Bears got him over the hump of must win games to save his job. If Campbell had lost to a pathetic Bears team I think he'd be in a lot more hot water this week and moving forward. He beat a team that he should and his guys hung tough and came back to deliver a nice win. So I think Campbell for now has himself in a safe position.

As far as draft position goes, if you want CJ Stroud or Bryce Young or Will Levis, chances are high, at least at this point, that you're going to need to be in the top 5-10-15 of the draft to get one of those players. So you either end up their because that's where your record puts you or end up there because you traded a bunch of capital to move up. I want this team to keep improving and simultaneously would prefer us to move on from Goff with a new QB, on a rookie wage scale. I don't hate Goff and don't think he's been a huge problem for us, sans 1-2 games this year.

I don't mind trading up to get a QB if we think one will be equal to or better than Goff: Stroud, Young, Levis, whoever. I think the rookie wage scale and small cap hit is enticing if the guy you draft ends up being as good or better than Goff. When you look at a team like the Dolphins, Tua may not be any better on paper than Jared Goff in the end. Where the advantage comes in for them is having the rookie wage scale that Tua is on so they can load up their roster and spend big to get guys like Tyreek Hill and Terron Armstead. One day soon they'll have to open the check book for Tua, but they can cross that bridge when they get there.

 

[Motown Bombers]

The Rams currently have the 8th pick, which is higher than the Lions, so we can actually root for the Lions to win and the Rams to lose and have a very high draft pick.

[Mr.TaterSalad]

I'd be just fine doing that!

[MichiganCardinal]

I think these are two remarkably similar teams. Their common opponents are the Cowboys (both lost), the Seahawks (both lost), the Bears (both won), and the Packers (both won). If you swapped their non-common opponents and had the Giants play the Eagles, Commies, Vikings, Patriots, and Dolphins, I think they probably go 1-4 or 2-5 ... If the Lions had played the Titans, Panthers, Ravens, Jaguars, and Texans, I think they probably go at least 3-2 and have a record better than 0.500 right now.

A road game against an evenly matched opponent should at least be a one-score game. I don't want to get blown out (obviously), but I also don't think it's fair to allow every game to be a referendum on the regime.

[RedRamage]

1 hour ago, MichiganCardinal said:

...but I also don't think it's fair to allow every game to be a referendum on the regime.

Each game?  Bah! I'm calling for Campbell to get fired if they don't win the coin toss.

[Mr.TaterSalad]

On 11/14/2022 at 4:27 PM, RandyMarsh said:

The Tennessee game was week 1 which is the most volatile week in the NFL so whether fair or not people don't put as much stock into those wins as others. Also Tennessee was short handed yet controlled most of the game, the Giants needed a late comeback to win by 1, again those are things analytics looks at, if you are getting beat for 50 out of the 60 minutes that is going to go against you. 

The Ravens game was even more lopsided, the Ravens controlled that game and had almost double the total yards, again it took a late comeback to win by 1 in a game they were getting beat the vast majority of the time. 

Yes the final score is all that matters but it doesn't always paint the picture on who was the better team majority of the game and in the Giants sake most of their wins have been those type which is why the metrics were so down on them. 

I get that the Ravens controlled most of that game, but the Giants fought all the way until the end and won. I feel however that just as Campbell deserves credit for bringing this team back against the Bears to pull out a win, Daboll deserves similar credit for keeping his team in it and rallying back in the 4th quarter to win against the Ravens. The Giants were within one score of beating the Cowboys. We weren't even within two scores of the Cowboys. They looked competitive and we did not.

The Giants may well prove to be frauds, as the Jets and Seahawks might too. The reason I focus on the Giants and Jets the most though is several reasons, Seahawks are different because of Pete Carroll and their GM John Schneider having been there for a long time.

First, those were two teams thought to be in similar stages of the rebuild as the Lions and early season indicators are that they are ahead of us. I knew our rebuild would likely be a 3 year process given how bad this roster was when Campbell and Holmes took over. Analysts and experts had the Giants and Jets rosters in similar situations and both teams have come out and been surprise teams thus far.

Second, it would be one thing if both of these teams were winning with elite-level QB play, but they aren't. Neither Daniel Jones nor Zach Wilson/Joe Flacco are out performing Goff. They are at best as good as Goff, but potentially worse than Goff and they are still winning games in spite of that. We had a top 5 offense through the first 5 weeks of the season, in a league predicated on offense to win game, and came out with one win.

Third, they are being coached by two guys I wanted here in Detroit over Campbell in Daboll and Saleh. Neither Daboll nor Saleh has had to fire a coordinator yet. Campbell already had to fire one and scapegoated Aubrey Pleasant in lieu of having to fire Aaron Glenn. I didn't hate the Campbell hire and I don't hate him as a coach now.  It's just frustrating when you see two teams that most analysts and experts had pegged to be competing for a top 5 pick along with us, instead in the playoff hunt midseason. It's also frustrating when you look at the offensive stats of a team, allow yourself to buy in as a result of that offensive production, and then have the rug pulled out from under you by a terrible defense and coaching mistakes.

I want the Lions to win on Sunday so me and other fans can shut up about the Giants and Daboll. Then, I want to go and beat the Jets so we can all shut up about the Jets and Saleh. I want them to win because I'd like to see them make the back half of this season interesting and maybe make a shot at the wildcard playoff spot. When you lose to a coach that is having more success than your guy and someone that people (myself or otherwise) wanted in Detroit, it just makes it that much harder and more frustrating. It also brings out all the second guessing and finger pointing, see, we should have hired "Coach X" over our guy.