buddha Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 7 hours ago, Motown Bombers said: Up until 2016, the Cubs were a worse franchise than the Lions so I would say this would be a new normal. the lions were worse than the cubs. the cubs were 6 outs away from a world series and won multiple playoff series in the 2000s prior to 2016. the lions won one playoff game in 70 years. 5 good years in the 50s doesnt make them anything. theyre the worst franchise in modern american sports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 17 minutes ago, buddha said: ... 5 good years in the 50s doesnt make them anything... It makes them better than the Cubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 6 hours ago, 1984Echoes said: It makes them better than the Cubs. no it doesnt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyMarsh Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 Before 2015 the Cubs won 1 playoff series in over a 100 years and of course zero championships. The Lions won 1 playoff game in the past 60 some years but have won numerous championships within the past 100. So I think it's fair to say that the Cubs were the more pathetic franchise at that point particularly when you factor in built in advantages like playing in the more desirable market, being one of the first teams to be broadcasted over cable so you can build a bigger fanbase and make your team more desirable along with bringing in more revenue. Despite having those advantages over the vast majority of teams they still sucked for most of the previous century. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motor City Sonics Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 St. Brown can dead lift almost 600 lbs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 18 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said: Before 2015 the Cubs won 1 playoff series in over a 100 years and of course zero championships. The Lions won 1 playoff game in the past 60 some years but have won numerous championships within the past 100. So I think it's fair to say that the Cubs were the more pathetic franchise at that point particularly when you factor in built in advantages like playing in the more desirable market, being one of the first teams to be broadcasted over cable so you can build a bigger fanbase and make your team more desirable along with bringing in more revenue. Despite having those advantages over the vast majority of teams they still sucked for most of the previous century. the lions won 3 times in the 50s in a 12 team league. other than that, thry have won one game in the postseason in 1991 and then were blown out the next week. they also play in a league with a salary cap and draft designed to make all of the teams equal, and they have the least amount of success of any franchise in that league's history. the cubs won the national league title and went to the league's championship series seven times before 1946. they won two playoff "rounds" in 2015 which is more than the lions, and have won numerous "playoff games" in between their trips to the world series, although with many more chances. it is also much harder to make the playoffs in baseball historically than football. the nature of football and the league changing the rules for more playoff teams, a harder salary cap, and a draft to distribute the best talent to the weakest teams (and the speed at which that talent can make a difference in football as opposed to baseball) makes it easier to achieve success in the nfl than in mlb. look, they both suck and this is a silly argument, but given the inherent structural advantages the nfl grants to teams as opposed to mlb historically, i would say the lions futility is at least equal to the cubs, and imo, greater. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 8 hours ago, buddha said: the lions were worse than the cubs. the cubs were 6 outs away from a world series and won multiple playoff series in the 2000s prior to 2016. the lions won one playoff game in 70 years. 5 good years in the 50s doesnt make them anything. theyre the worst franchise in modern american sports. The Cubs won two playoff series in a span of over 100 years. They went 108 years without a championship. They went over 70 years without even playing in a championship. They were cursed by a billy goat. They were the worst franchise up until 2016. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motor City Sonics Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 17 minutes ago, buddha said: look, they both suck and this is a silly argument, but given the inherent structural advantages the nfl grants to teams as opposed to mlb historically, i would say the lions futility is at least equal to the cubs, and imo, greater. Oh yeah..........drafting for MLB is much more of a crap-shoot and it's a 4-5 years down the road thing. For the NFL you draft players that should be helping you immediately meaning that you should be able to recognize talent easier. Just look at the 2nd round of the NFL draft through the years. 2nd round players are supposed to be starters that contribute...........the biggest consistent failure of the Lions over the years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Motown Bombers said: The Cubs won two playoff series in a span of over 100 years. They went 108 years without a championship. They went over 70 years without even playing in a championship. They were cursed by a billy goat. They were the worst franchise up until 2016. wrong. and the white sox were just as futile as the cubs up until they lucked their way into a world series that everyone forgets about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, buddha said: wrong. and the white sox were just as futile as the cubs up until they lucked their way into a world series that everyone forgets about. What is wrong? They won one playoff series in 2015 and one in 2003. Their last championship prior to 2016 was 1908. The last World Series they played in prior to 2016 was 1945. I would also say the White Sox were worse than the Lions pre 2005 as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hongbit Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 Is this an argument on if the Lions were a better franchise than two baseball teams from 1950 - 2016 even though now all agree the Lions have been worse for the last 6 years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 4 minutes ago, Hongbit said: Is this an argument on if the Lions were a better franchise than two baseball teams from 1950 - 2016 even though now all agree the Lions have been worse for the last 6 years? It's whatever you want it to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 47 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: What is wrong? They won one playoff series in 2015 and one in 2003. Their last championship prior to 2016 was 1908. The last World Series they played in prior to 2016 was 1945. I would also say the White Sox were worse than the Lions pre 2005 as well. its wrong for all the reasons i said in my response to randy. look, this isnt a mathematical formula, there is no "right answer." its an opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, buddha said: its wrong for all the reasons i said in my response to randy. look, this isnt a mathematical formula, there is no "right answer." its an opinion. There is no right answer but yet you say I'm wrong. How does that work? I see you included the wild card play in game as a playoff round victory and then also said it's easier to make the playoff in the NFL. Ironically, had MLB not expanded the wild card to include a play in game only 3 years prior, the Cubs would have never made the playoffs in 2015. They would have never made the playoffs in 2003 had MLB not added the wild card in 1995. Post 1946, the Lions have 3 championships to the Cubs one and played in 4 championships to the Cubs one. The Lions still overall have more championships than the Cubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 I'm going to say the White Sox are a worse franchise than the Lions. Their only playoff series win since 1917 came in 2005. From 1919 to 2005 they only made one World Series in 1959 and lost. They only made the playoffs four times in that 85 year stretch and lost each time and I haven't even mentioned the Black Sox scandal. The White Sox get big points for recency bias for the 2005 championship, but I'll say it, the White Sox are a worse franchise than the Lions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.TaterSalad Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 What's the equivalent in baseball to going winless in football? Having the worst record of all time maybe in a single season? Going winless is a pretty bad stain upon a franchise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Mr.TaterSalad said: What's the equivalent in baseball to going winless in football? Having the worst record of all time maybe in a single season? Going winless is a pretty bad stain upon a franchise. The 2003 Tigers. The Lions share that record with Cleveland and technically Tampa. When you look at the Lions history, it's a lot like the White Sox. Bad but not always the worst. In 120 years the White Sox have lost 100 games 4 times. The Tigers meanwhile have done it 7 times. As bad as the Lions have been, they've only drafted number one overall twice. The Lions have actually finished 2nd in the division more often than they have finished last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganCardinal Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 13 hours ago, AlaskanTigersFan said: Isn't it crazy that people are already talking about firing Campbell? Man I hope they give him a fair shake to turn the ship around. I think he's on the right track. Has there been talk of that? I haven’t seen it. Randy said above that he’s a favorite in Vegas for awards. I don’t think his seat is even remotely warm after the way the team ended the 2021 season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 Can probably remove Murray as a potential Goff replacement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 31 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: Can probably remove Murray as a potential Goff replacement. on to lamar jackson? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.TaterSalad Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 I wasn't necessarily on or off the Murray wagon. I do think Murray is a talented QB, but that contracting looks like it could be an albatross if the cap doesn't rise fast enough and Murray doesn't play at an elite level. I'm still waiting to see, with little hope, what Goff can bring us this year and if Campbell and Ben Johnson can bring out his best game. If not, we've got the draft capital needed to possibly make a move up the draft ladder and go and get one of Stroud, Young, Richardson, whomever is at the top-tier of the QB class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hongbit Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 (edited) Murray can be elite if they can find a way to still incorporate his mobility and running ability into the offense and keep him upright. If they want to make him an in the pocket QB then this may go down as one of the worst signings. He hasn’t shown Russ Wilson accuracy in the pocket and his presence for such small guy is a work in progress to say the least. Edited July 21, 2022 by Hongbit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 31 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said: If not, we've got the draft capital needed to possibly make a move up the draft ladder and go and get one of Stroud, Young, Richardson, whomever is at the top-tier of the QB class. multiple teams do and multiple teams need qbs. that's my worry there. every team that is supposed to suck needs a young qb except for the bears. carolina, atlanta, ny giants. eagles could be looking for a qb too and have multiple picks. that said, it looks like there are a lot of good prospects heading into this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganCardinal Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 3 hours ago, buddha said: multiple teams do and multiple teams need qbs. that's my worry there. every team that is supposed to suck needs a young qb except for the bears. carolina, atlanta, ny giants. eagles could be looking for a qb too and have multiple picks. that said, it looks like there are a lot of good prospects heading into this season. I have faith that if Holmes wants someone who slips into Mahomes territory (I'll define that loosely as 8-16), he will be able to go and get his guy. He worked magic to get Jameson Williams. I'm not worried too much about where we land. A package with our 1st, the Rams 1st, and a 2024 1st will give us a lot of latitude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 41 minutes ago, MichiganCardinal said: I have faith that if Holmes wants someone who slips into Mahomes territory (I'll define that loosely as 8-16), he will be able to go and get his guy. He worked magic to get Jameson Williams. I'm not worried too much about where we land. A package with our 1st, the Rams 1st, and a 2024 1st will give us a lot of latitude. ok, but i imagine 3 of the top 4 picks will be qbs and the teams picking in those slots will want qbs. holmes might want one and it wont matter because they wont be able to go up and get the one they want. but we'll see. its a long season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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