Week Six: Detroit Lions (4-1) @ Tampa Bay Buccaneers (3-1)

[Stanley70]

Goff is a legit top tier QB now. I didn't believe he could reach this level of play because QB's with his physical limitiations usually have a lower ceiling. Tom Brady's and Drew Brees are pretty rare. Even moreso in today's NFL.

He processes plays in the middle of the field as well as any QB, plus he makes very few mistakes and knows when to give up on the play. His greatest strength is his accuracy however. 

I'm sure Campbell and Ben unlocked some of that but it is obviously difficult to to just teach those things.

[Shinzaki]

The Lions have a lot more wide open receivers under Johnson than they have at any point in my recent memory.  Like most QB's...Goff is deadly when he can set his feet and make a throw without someone in his face.  Goff does a great job of understanding where that receiver is or will be..before the defense has a chance to react and make the play.  Goff has also improved tremendously  on his deep throws.

Goff, Johnson and Campbell really have things going well right now

[MichiganCardinal]

11 minutes ago, TP_Fan said:

Campbell called the plays after Lynn was canned.  Ben was promoted to OC but wasn’t calling plays. I don’t have a huge fear of Ben Johnson leaving because Campbell will still be here. 

I think I was concerned a little last year when he was set to possibly leave because it didn't seem we had an obvious heir apparent. I don't think that will be an issue this year if (when) he leaves. If I had to levy a guess today, I would put money on Tanner Engstrand being groomed for the role this year. He's gone from TE Coach to Passing Game Coordinator, which is the same progression Ben Johnson took before being named OC. It could be Scottie Montgomery or Steve Heiden though too.

In any event, I'm sure they'll be prepared, and I agree that the Lions success on both sides of the ball, but particularly on offense, is in large part thanks to Campbell. 

[1984Echoes]

1 hour ago, TP_Fan said:

The complaint is to 2nd and long runs.  Not runs in general. 

I think you're missing the point. 

2nd and long runs are:

a) to set up a 3rd down play; which could be play action, misdirection, or a pass, or even another run depending on circumstances. 2nd and long runs are not for the pleasure of fans; they are for setting up the defense the way an OC/ HC wants it to be set up. Quit complaining about 2nd and long runs and "key" in on 3rd down conversions. THAT's the key. Or conversion % if you're just looking at stats (during the game the conversions are more important.)

b) They still: take heat off the QB/ eat clock/ keep it conservative if that is what is needed/ wear down a defense/ MAY even set up a play that is NOT in this series but later in the game, during a key drive/ etc.

Just my 2 cents.

[MichiganCardinal]

I generally find it hard to complain or harshly comment about much, offensive or defensive, when we are 5-1.

That said, I think evaluating an NFL offenses play-calling based on a binary of "run" vs. "pass" on any given down is probably a vast oversimplification. The goal of every drive is to score but that doesn't mean that the goal of a 2nd and 9 run play from the -26 is a 74-yard touchdown run.

[gehringer_2]

47 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said:

to set up a 3rd down play;

right. the 95% goal of 2nd and long is to get to 3rd and manageable. If a 5 yrd run gets you to 3rd and 3 that was 100% a successful call- esp for a team that runs the ball well enough that the D cannot assume pass at that down and distance.

[1984Echoes]

1 hour ago, MichiganCardinal said:

I generally find it hard to complain or harshly comment about much, offensive or defensive, when we are 5-1.

That said, I think evaluating an NFL offenses play-calling based on a binary of "run" vs. "pass" on any given down is probably a vast oversimplification. The goal of every drive is to score but that doesn't mean that the goal of a 2nd and 9 run play from the -26 is a 74-yard touchdown run.

Or even a 1st down.

It may be simply to get a defense moving, or looking a certain way, and then: convert the 3rd down.

[RedRamage]

Anyone else think Mayfield sorta kinda looks like The Deep here? 

[djhutch]

3 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said:

Or even a 1st down.

It may be simply to get a defense moving, or looking a certain way, and then: convert the 3rd down.

Or set them up for a call later in the game.

 

20 hours ago, Motor City Sonics said:

Wow, he overthrew Palmer again....................They have to go for it here, don't they? 

I thought while listening to the call of the game, Moose kept saying "That's a throw Baker Mayfield won't miss later in the season" - That's who Baker Mayfield is.  He always has been.  That's the knock on him.  If he hits a wide open receiver last season with the Rams, we make the playoffs instead of Seattle. 

[RedRamage]

 

That's a lot of BLUE right there...

[Tigeraholic1]

13 minutes ago, RedRamage said:

 

That's a lot of BLUE right there...

You keep seeing this and most seats are not nose bleeds folks spending big money on the road. I have never sat in the lower level at an NFL game, too salty for me.

[TP_Fan]

5 minutes ago, Tigeraholic1 said:

You keep seeing this and most seats are not nose bleeds folks spending big money on the road. I have never sat in the lower level at an NFL game, too salty for me.

I am a lower bowl snub. But I only go to one or two games a year and I get vertigo.

I always look for seats in the end zone, 4 or 5 rows from the top and right next to a bathroom and food.  Never have to wait in line or miss any action. 

[MichiganCardinal]

47 minutes ago, TP_Fan said:

I am a lower bowl snub. But I only go to one or two games a year and I get vertigo.

I always look for seats in the end zone, 4 or 5 rows from the top and right next to a bathroom and food.  Never have to wait in line or miss any action. 

I’d like to expand my season ticket arsenal next year if there are tickets to be had. I love my seventh row lower bowl seats for rabid fan time. Monday Night, playoff game, bringing the fellow rabid fan, that’ll be the spot.

If I’m bringing my mom though, or I’m going to a preseason game, I think I’d rather have a club level seat. Nicer seats (physical seats not location wise), more casual spot for viewing while still an awesome view. And if I pick up two in the club level I can always sell or gift the other two I don’t use.

[buddha]

1 hour ago, RedRamage said:

 

That's a lot of BLUE right there...

the detroit diaspora is real.

a lot of wings games are still like that, especially in warm weather spots where all the factories moved.  😞

[Cruzer1]

Two plays, the 45 yard pass to Jameson, then another pass to a wide open St. Brown, shows the affects that having Williams is having for the Lions...the first one at 16:47, and the next play at 19:18...I recommend this channel highly...

 

[Motor City Sonics]

Tell ya what,  Baker Mayfield isn't that good, but that dude is tough as hell.   

 

What is the Lions record since firing Aubrey Pleasant?    Is it 13-4 ? 

 

[NYLion]

21 hours ago, Stanley70 said:

Goff is a legit top tier QB now. I didn't believe he could reach this level of play because QB's with his physical limitiations usually have a lower ceiling. Tom Brady's and Drew Brees are pretty rare. Even moreso in today's NFL.

He processes plays in the middle of the field as well as any QB, plus he makes very few mistakes and knows when to give up on the play. His greatest strength is his accuracy however. 

I'm sure Campbell and Ben unlocked some of that but it is obviously difficult to to just teach those things.

Accuracy and Football IQ is king. If you have those things, you'll be successful and Goff has that. His arm isn't quite as strong as Brady's and nobody manipulates a defense like Brady did but Goff has a similar skillset and mind for the game. He also stands in the face of pressure, especially now with his newfound confidence, so it's not like he needs a perfectly clean pocket to succeed. 

[Motor City Sonics]

**** ESPN's power rankings

 

Chiefs at #2?   Lions at #5?    Who beat who on who's turf?     Chiefs don't look better than the Lions......or Eagles...or Dolphins.....or 49ers.        Lions just go on the road and beat good teams, that's all.      If they won their coin flip in the Seattle game, they'd probably be #1.      Always an agenda with ESPN. 

[Motor City Sonics]

4 minutes ago, NYLion said:

Accuracy and Football IQ is king. If you have those things, you'll be successful and Goff has that. His arm isn't quite as strong as Brady's and nobody manipulates a defense like Brady did but Goff has a similar skillset and mind for the game. He also stands in the face of pressure, especially now with his newfound confidence, so it's not like he needs a perfectly clean pocket to succeed. 

I don't know, Goff's arm is stronger than people think.     But Brady didn't have that strong an arm,  he didn't have much mobility, he was like Gretzky.........seeing the play before it happens.      Goff has a bit of that.    Not saying he's Brady-level, but he's certainly better than Sean McVay thinks.   thankfully for us. 

[Shinzaki]

20 minutes ago, Motor City Sonics said:

**** ESPN's power rankings

 

Chiefs at #2?   Lions at #5?    Who beat who on who's turf?     Chiefs don't look better than the Lions......or Eagles...or Dolphins.....or 49ers.        Lions just go on the road and beat good teams, that's all.      If they won their coin flip in the Seattle game, they'd probably be #1.      Always an agenda with ESPN. 

Kendall at the Athletic has us at #3 behind the Fins and the 49ers but ahead of Philly

[RedRamage]

17 hours ago, MichiganCardinal said:

...gift the other two I don’t use.

Well, ya know... if, uh... you're every looking for someone to give them too...

[NYLion]

31 minutes ago, Motor City Sonics said:

I don't know, Goff's arm is stronger than people think.     But Brady didn't have that strong an arm,  he didn't have much mobility, he was like Gretzky.........seeing the play before it happens.      Goff has a bit of that.    Not saying he's Brady-level, but he's certainly better than Sean McVay thinks.   thankfully for us. 

Brady didn't have much mobility in terms of speed but his pocket presence and ability to sidestep the rush was unmatched especially earlier in his career. His accuracy on deep balls was top notch as well. He didn't have a canon like Stafford or Rodgers but he consistently dropped dimes while the one knock on Goff is that he's inconsistent on the deep throws. Still, we're talking about a guy playing at an MVP level so this is just nitpicking.

[Shinzaki]

We got Goff and two 1sts for Stafford...it's our Hershel Walker trade

[RedRamage]

35 minutes ago, Motor City Sonics said:

**** ESPN's power rankings

 

Chiefs at #2?   Lions at #5?    Who beat who on who's turf?     Chiefs don't look better than the Lions......or Eagles...or Dolphins.....or 49ers.        Lions just go on the road and beat good teams, that's all.      If they won their coin flip in the Seattle game, they'd probably be #1.      Always an agenda with ESPN. 

It's hard not to rely on history. The Chiefs have a proven track record and it's easy to dismiss a week one game without two of their star players. I can't fault anyone for ranking the Chiefs ahead of the Lions right now. You have five teams at 5-1... Two of them were in the SB last year, another was in the NFC Championship game. Of the remaining two one has a super high powered offense that's putting up 37+ pts per game on average and probably would have done better last year if it weren't for QB injury issues.

The last team had a great finish to last year and has looked good, but (playing devil's advocate here):
Game 1: Beat a great team missing two star players
Game 2: Lost to the Seahawks
Game 3: Beat the 3-3 Falcons
Game 4: Beat the 2-3 Packers
Game 5: Beat the 0-6 Panthers
Game 6: Beat the 3-2 Bucs

Other than the first game there's no big statement wins and we all know that that game has that asterisk on it, so...

 

[Mr.TaterSalad]

51 minutes ago, Shinzaki said:

We got Goff and two 1sts for Stafford...it's our Hershel Walker trade

Right now, no matter how good we are playing, the Rams are the winners of that trade. The goal is to win a Super Bowl and be the very best and they did that. Now we just have to get our Super Bowl this year to match it!