Trade Deadline

[MichiganCardinal]

3 hours ago, holygoat said:

The first step of building a team from nothing is different from taking the final step to championship level. You use your draft picks in the draft when building because you need as much cost-effective talent as possible to build your core. Holmes has completed that step, as well as the second step of surrounding that core with quality depth. We're now at the final step where one or two great pieces can put your team over the top to be legitimate SB contenders. I'm not saying to go all Eff Them Picks, but eff some of them if it gets you a stud at an important position.

I agree with this. But I also think we are a championship caliber team as we stand here today. I think we could beat any given team in the NFL on any given Sunday. Some could beat us on any given Sunday too obviously, but I’m not sure there is a massive amount of relative benefit to attaining the “stars” who might be available.

I’d be surprised if Holmes makes a blockbuster trade before the deadline. I just don’t think one is necessary for us to win multiple(!) playoff games. That’s not to say I would be immediately opposed if he does make one, just that I think he is a good drafter and a confident drafter, and is cognizant that a lot (all of?) the core players we’ve got still haven’t been paid.

With the core you’ve got here, you can build a legitimate dynasty with continued right moves in the draft. No need to throw that away for one 2020 Cleveland Browns run.

[Jimbo]

I feel like the difference with this Lions team compared to other teams in the past going for a Superbowl is its young.  The hope is we will be top 5 contenders for a while.  Now if we can get a player like a Crosby and not give up the farm, I am good with it.  We will not be in a bad situation next year with the salary cap although we are going to have to start paying some of our star players on rookie contracts soon (and Goff).  When you start having to do that, your going to have to let players leave.  That is fine when you have an affective GM like Holmes, because you fill those holes with draft picks.  I am just not sure with this team, you need to make the huge splash.  I would be fine if they did, I just don't see them doing it.  I think they will make a couple of smart trades.  Depth and maybe gamble on a player that isn't having a good year but has a history of being a pro bowl or cusp type player that would thrive on a team like ours (not someone in their prime but still has a lot left). 

[Jimbo]

I think a good question is, who do you consider the core of this team right now?  By that I mean, who are the players you would be willing to pay a top 5 salary to (or the highest at that position) with their next contract.  These are players that you can't afford to let go and are the heart and soul of this team.  Basically franchise tag players.  This is important because if you are thinking of making that big splash at the trade deadline, it could mean losing 1 or 2 of these guys.  I think my list right now is Hutch, Sewell, Jonah, Laporta, Branch, Joseph, and St. Brown.  Goff will be there for me if he wins a playoff game or we get a bye this year.  The team will have to figure out Decker's situation because when his contract is up, I think he will be 31.   Hopefully he takes a little less to stay with the team after this next contract.   Incomplete list is Jaymo, Cambell, and Gibbs.  Although I would be surprised if Jaymo ends up a top 5 WR.  There are issues with LB's and RB's and long term big contracts and a reason why a lot of people had issues with drafting them in the first round.

Edited October 12, 2023 by Jimbo

[RandyMarsh]

To me at this point Goff, Hutch and Sewell are the core guys who I want to keep at all costs long term.

Id like to keep St.Brown long term as well but I think he would be easier to replace then the core 3 I mentioned so he wouldn't be as much of a priority for me, McNeill falls into this as well. 

You're not gonna be able to keep everybody but fortunately we have a little time before we are forced to choose who we don't pay and by then hopefully Brad will have already drafted a guy(s) could be the replacement.

[holygoat]

I'd add Brian Branch to that list, and if you're keeping Goff -- which I would -- I'm keeping St. Brown, too. 

[Jimbo]

2 hours ago, Jimbo said:

From ESPN

This is just an ESPN proposal.  This didn't really happen lol

[Shinzaki]

I would not be in favor of it...we don't need to spend that kind of capital to upgrade our edge rushers.  If they can propose something involving a CB...ok

[1984Echoes]

Maxx Crosby is a LB'er, not a DE... that's why I'd be more open to adding him. He's explosive and dominating and a game-changer... I would absolutely consider adding him as long as the cost is not outrageous...

But yes, CB is a higher priority due to need.

Also... back to the edge... if the right guy is available at the right price, I would NOT say no. I think Montez Sweat is that guy.

Other depth guys to think about:

a vet WR like DJ Chark. Might be better depth than Jones so that's the thought.

A depth O-Lineman if Holmes/ Campbell felt there was a need. Probably not, just sayin'...

And always on the lookout for RB depth because health is always precarious there...

[Mr.TaterSalad]

On 10/12/2023 at 12:37 PM, Jimbo said:

This is just an ESPN proposal.  This didn't really happen lol

I'd literally offer them the 3rd round pick and see if they took that. I think this is a bit much for a 29 year old edge rusher. I'd consider bumping that 3rd up to a 2nd. But to give up a 2nd, 3rd, and James Houston is too much value.

[1984Echoes]

My trade deadline priorities (based on wishful thinking):

First Priority: Patrick Surtain II

Second Priority: Maxx Crosby

[Shinzaki]

Leonard Fournette is visiting Buffalo...with our issues at RB...I wouldn't mind be a Kenny Holland tire kicker on him

[MichiganCardinal]

 

[NYLion]

On 10/12/2023 at 10:12 AM, RandyMarsh said:

To me at this point Goff, Hutch and Sewell are the core guys who I want to keep at all costs long term.

Id like to keep St.Brown long term as well but I think he would be easier to replace then the core 3 I mentioned so he wouldn't be as much of a priority for me, McNeill falls into this as well. 

You're not gonna be able to keep everybody but fortunately we have a little time before we are forced to choose who we don't pay and by then hopefully Brad will have already drafted a guy(s) could be the replacement.

St. Brown is absolutely a priority. Top 10 receiver in the league, one of the real leaders of the team, big time competitor, as clutch as a player can get. Maybe not as much priority as QB but he's just as important as those other guys in terms of on field impact and leadership.

Edited October 24, 2023 by NYLion

[1984Echoes]

1 hour ago, MichiganCardinal said:

 

How about both?

[RedRamage]

18 hours ago, MichiganCardinal said:

Fixed that for the Lions...

[Cruzer1]

On 10/12/2023 at 12:37 PM, Jimbo said:

This is just an ESPN proposal.  This didn't really happen lol

Please make sure you let that be known on the original post. Thank you.

[Cruzer1]

1 hour ago, RedRamage said:

Fixed that for the Lions...

They don't really need to fix both now.

[Mr.TaterSalad]

I would love to acquire a high-end talent like Brian Burns, Chase Young, Maxx Crosby, Danielle Hunter, or Budda Baker. I just don't see us in the market for that type of a talent given the draft capital we would likely have to give up and the cap hit that player might take up.

I still believe Holmes, if he makes a move at all, will trade for a mid-level starter on defense or a rotational player like Montez Sweat, Cam Jordan, or Adoree Jackson. I think Holmes likes to have draft capital at his expense and likes to sign guys that are on more team-friendly deals. I believe Holmes wants to save his cap space for his guys, That he's drafted as well.

If that is the case, I partially disagree with it. If you have the chance to get a game changing talent, when you're on the cusp of being a very good team and a division winner, you need to make a impact move now when you're team has its window to win open.

[NYLion]

12 hours ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

I would love to acquire a high-end talent like Brian Burns, Chase Young, Maxx Crosby, Danielle Hunter, or Budda Baker. I just don't see us in the market for that type of a talent given the draft capital we would likely have to give up and the cap hit that player might take up.

I still believe Holmes, if he makes a move at all, will trade for a mid-level starter on defense or a rotational player like Montez Sweat, Cam Jordan, or Adoree Jackson. I think Holmes likes to have draft capital at his expense and likes to sign guys that are on more team-friendly deals. I believe Holmes wants to save his cap space for his guys, That he's drafted as well.

If that is the case, I partially disagree with it. If you have the chance to get a game changing talent, when you're on the cusp of being a very good team and a division winner, you need to make a impact move now when you're team has its window to win open.

The window to win JUST opened, there's no need to rush a significant "win now" trade. I wouldn't be against it but it needs to be for a player with term on his deal like Crosby for instance or Surtain who could be a long term solution. I wouldn't be a fan of what the Rams did with Von Miller for instance, I just don't think the Lions are at that point yet.

[number20]

If Holmes wants to make a splash move for a defensive unicorn, it will undeliably cost 2 firsts. The Lions would have no picks in the first round until 2026 (ugh), and I just can’t see him doing that. I’m expecting a move for corner depth though.

The one argument for going all in on ‘win now’ would be to capitalize on that comically favorable schedule of theirs. It’s unlikely they’ll see this easy of a path to a 1 or 2 seed for years

[Sports_Freak]

On 10/12/2023 at 12:37 PM, Jimbo said:

This is just an ESPN proposal.  This didn't really happen lol

Lucky thing. This is a horrible trade.

[Sports_Freak]

2 hours ago, number20 said:

If Holmes wants to make a splash move for a defensive unicorn, it will undeliably cost 2 firsts. The Lions would have no picks in the first round until 2026 (ugh), and I just can’t see him doing that. I’m expecting a move for corner depth though.

The one argument for going all in on ‘win now’ would be to capitalize on that comically favorable schedule of theirs. It’s unlikely they’ll see this easy of a path to a 1 or 2 seed for years

I can't agree with this. A lack of QB talent in our division means we should be division favorites the next few seasons. And it wouldn't take much to get us all the way to a 2nd seed. A #1 seed is always improbable, you need to be the absolute best in the conference. That would take some injury luck, something we never seem to get.

[MichiganCardinal]

9 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said:

I can't agree with this. A lack of QB talent in our division means we should be division favorites the next few seasons. And it wouldn't take much to get us all the way to a 2nd seed. A #1 seed is always improbable, you need to be the absolute best in the conference. That would take some injury luck, something we never seem to get.

Counterargument - you don't want to be the Browns. The Browns thought they saw their window, sold the farm with three firsts to get Deshaun Watson, sold their morals and any good feelings they had with the rest of the NFL by giving him a fully guaranteed contract, and ended up with a worse QB than they had before him.

Obviously QB is not a defensive talent, and no one (at least hopefully no one) is advocating for giving a defensive talent a fully guaranteed franchise dependent contract... but I think if the last 2 1/2 years have taught us anything, it's that Holmes has a plan. It would just be very uncharacteristic for him to break that and go "all in" on someone. Now, if we are sitting five years from now, with an aging Goff and a couple OGs like Hutch and ASB looking for third contracts, and we've been spinning our wheels with early exits in the playoffs. Then, the writing might be on the wall to give it one more Rams-like shove. As of now though, I think this is only year three of Holmes' plan and I doubt year three involves the step "after a 5-2 start abandon your master plan to add a single defensive talent".

I think the Lions have been set up masterfully by Holmes and Co. to have sustained success. I don't care about the Packers, Bears, or Vikings - if we can win 10 games a year, we will make the playoffs. And if you make the playoffs, you're only a short winning streak away from pay dirt.

[MichiganCardinal]

Of the premier defensive talents, Maxx Crosby is the only one I think I'd want based on culture and positional fit, and I doubt the Raiders are trading him. Maybe a 40-point win on Monday Night will lead them to fire McDaniels and blow it all up, and Holmes won't let Crosby get on the plane back to Vegas? One can dream.

[1984Echoes]

14 minutes ago, MichiganCardinal said:

Counterargument - you don't want to be the Browns.

... Holmes has a plan. It would just be very uncharacteristic for him to break that and go "all in" on someone...

Counter-Counterargument - Trust in Holmes.

I also don't believe he would go "all in" or "go for broke" for anyone...

But what I would say... is that if Holmes makes a trade for 1 guy or 4 guys (CB, DE, WR, a... kicker?!); that he will properly assess talent and the value of that talent and not overpay. Which may or may not include a top star that is expensive (in draft capital and future Salary cost/ commitment); but, most importantly I don't think he will "bet the farm" on any 1 guy and just throw away too much in future draft capital... I think he would make opportunistic trades (let's just say DJ Chark for a future 6th... just throwing something like that out), find a guy who he can get for value (IE: an under-the-radar CB for a 5th...), and may even decide that he can afford to trade an excess player to reduce the cost of obtaining a guy (Jerry Jacobs + 1st for a top CB or Houston + draft pick for...). Not that those players are excess, but trading for a guy that fits into their position will make a guy, or several guys possibly, expendable.

I have no idea what is or is not workable in NFL trades... I guess all I am saying is that I Trust in Holmes to make the right decisions on players/ cost. I'll wait to see what he ends up actually doing or not doing and evaluate from there. But I believe 100% in his ability to evaluate and assess...