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I think you have a lot of company on this. I simply disagree with this idea completely, even if the step back were to entail only 2026, which I don't think is necessarily a given. The Detroit Tigers are on a definite momentous path of contending for a World Series in 2026. Not just make the playoffs next year—the Kansas City Royals hope they will simply make to the playoffs next year. That's not us. We are clearly trajecting toward the World Series. With Skubal in the fold, a few of the right offseason and deadline moves, and progress from key young players, we are on a clear path to get the World Series next year. I don't know any general manager worth his s**t who, while on that trajectory, would put an immediate halt to it so he could position his team to get back to that same place no sooner than three years from now, which is 2028, at best, and probably more like 2029 or even 2030. For one thing, the fans would go absolutely ape**** after winning playoff series the last two years, and now being told that the payoffs are no longer the primary goal the following year. Okay? That would be bad enough. But what is arguably even worse is that Harris would lose the players in the organization with such a strategy. What does it tell a Riley Greene or Spencer Torkelson—or, fine, if you don't give a **** what those guys think, then a Dillon Dingler, or a Jackson Jobe, or Kevin McGonigle or Max Clark or a dozen other ranked young talents—that you as a general manager are willing to halt an organization's progress toward a World Series now for the expressed purpose of putting us back on that same track to make the World Series three or four years from now? And not only the players in this organization, but also, the free agents outside of this organization. What halfway decent free agent in his right mind is going to sign with a team operating with the expressed intent of going backward the year they come aboard? Who on god's green earth would want to sign up for that? And not only free agents this year, but free agents every single year Scott Harris is running this team. No top-tier free agent would ever want to devote the best earning years of his life to an organization who has proved that, at any given moment, they are willing to blow it all up and go backwards because it might pay out four or five years now. Trading Tarik Skubal this winter is practically guaranteed to limit our prospective free agent pool to guys who are willing to sign one-year prove-it deals, and nothing more, for the rest of Harris's tenure with us. And, bonus: Harris would be undertaking such a strategy when not only is there no immediate payroll pressure building on him, but the payroll pressure is actually easing on him. That just strikes me as absolutely bonkers. Now: I get that it strikes you as absolutely bonkers that I would want to hang onto Skubal and take a chance that the team collapses in 2026, misses the playoffs anyway, fails to sign Skubal long term, loses him to the market, and all we get is some ****ty draft pick for him, if that. I can see why someone would want to avoid that circumstance at all costs which, obviously, includes the cost of giving up a generationally-talented pitcher in his prime for the next year. So, it would be fair of you to ask me: am I, chasfh, willing to roll the dice, keep Skubal for possibly one and only one more year, and perhaps miss out on the playoffs, lose him afterwards, and start over with the guys we have left? And I would answer: yes! Yes! A thousand more times yes! And I say that because we are in a position of contending for a World Series now. That hasn't come around these parts very often and, not to put too fine a point on it, I ain't getting any younger. And I do not want to give that up just to play not to lose in some vague, indeterminate future. But, also, I would want Scott Harris to demonstrate to players both inside and outside the organization that when it's our time to compete, we put the pedal to the floor, instead of putting the car in the garage. To me, that's probably the most important consideration Scott Harris should have as he reviews the options he has before him this winter. I love ya, man, but we're gonna have to disagree on this and keep arguing about it for the next few months.

the unknowns that remains are around how much all the physics metrics get to the last, hardest part of hitting as a player levels up to the top tiers, and that is the tougher decision making. i.e., Your ability to barrel up more balls better than the next guy against AA pitching isn't necessarily 100% indicative of your ability to see and react to spin at MLB command and velo levels. Recognizing better disguised pitches and decreased processing time are parts that remain as hurdles that are harder to project from lower level data. That - and of course injuries, are residual uncertainties even with the tech. To me the irony is that the better metrics do tell you almost everything about a pitcher today - those more subtle vision/processing issues don't apply to their art, but the injury risk with pitchers is so high today that the increased certainty about their stuff still leaves huge overall uncertainty there as well. 🤷‍♂️

I guess I don’t do enough mind-altering drugs to post my thoughts on the return in a trade of Skubal. 😎

Calling Democrats “hostage-takers” ignores reality: the GOP can’t even get enough votes on its own bill. Procedural math > political blame.

If we trade Skubal, our trajectory will go backward, not forward. I can hardly imagine the ****storm that would rain down on Harris if he were to trade Skubal and we miss the playoffs next year.

Who can forget this iconic moment.

Trump/Epstein body count

One thing about analytics is that this mindset can lead some to believe that the game is played on a spreadsheet. It is not. I agree that with Skubal, internal improvements, and a few key FA investments, this team could make a deep postseason run. As a front office and as an ownership group, you have to demonstrate to your team and the league that you intend to compete as hard as you can. It would be a massive failure not to go all-in on at least one more season with Skubal.

First time voting as a Detroiter

Dingler's already under control for the next five seasons, so, what kind of extension do you want to see?

And yet top prospects still fail at very high levels due to a variety of reasons. Edited to add: And I still think you are greatly overestimating the return that will be out there for 1 year of Skubal.

There is only one guy I can think of who would gladly empty out the top of the farm system for one year of a Cy Young winner who would likely leave the following year, and that guy doesn’t work here anymore.

Polling place was busy. I saw lots of middle-aged dudes going over to get the sample ballot from the Dem lady and nobody stopped by the 3 GOP people.

Heading off to vote. Hope it counts.

I learned the concept of "don't pay someone until you have to" from a former poster here and I think it's valid. Especially given the uncertainty with the labor situation. If you think you have a good system in place you should be able to replace him. You don't need back to back Cy Young pitchers to replace him but a couple of players who might finish top ten.

Did Thompson just go three consecutive defensive possessions of block, steal, block?

Plenty of money to bail out argentina but not for US Americans. https://thehill.com/homenews/5587414-senate-gop-blocks-dem-effort-fund-snap/amp/

No team is going to do that trade. Why would they trade a younger and cheaper version of Skubal that they have for a few more years? And another one? And a position player? No team is that deep and on paper they have just made their team weaker in 2026 and most likely 2027 and 2028.

If you read the ****ing tweet and replies you would see the very logical reasons why. But logic isn’t something required by insane right wingers obsessed with this race. for those who didn’t…. He’s on the ballot twice because he’s nominated by two parties. So is Curtis Sliwa. Adam’s didn’t drop out in time. Cuomo is nominated by a fringe party and they go near the end. my god this isn’t complicated. But I know thinking is.

I'm not sure we would get that kind of return even for Skubal. The Dodgers obviously don't need him and other teams value top 100 prospects quite highly . This is why I now am off the fence and think we will retain him for 2026. Now if Harris could get 3 or 4 top 100 prospects , providing there are teams with that many, then yes he will be moved. Yamamoto won three World Series games and in so doing proved how valuable a shut down starter is over a seven game series so we should keep him since he is the best "David" to the Dodgers "Goliath" in the game. Remember losing him to free agency in 2027 is hard but we still have the cash to expense elsewhere. Use it wisely and draft well and the gap to not trading him closes substantially.

The Lions had to trade for Hendrickson. Now it’s going to be Zeitler who wasn’t traded and maybe the Titans didn’t want their rookie QBs playing behind a bad line.

Republicans control both chambers, but somehow it’s the Democrats “holding the country hostage”? That’s like blaming the passenger when the driver runs out of gas.

They aren't loaded at one of the positions that matters the most though and that is the offensive line. They have a banged up LT who is game to game as to whether he even plays. They lost their starting LG for an indefinite amount of time. We saw how piss poor the OLine played just this past weekend and that was before Mahogany went down. I don't think it would have set this franchise back that terribly financially if they had made a move to bring in another starter on the line. I do in-fact believe it would have provided them a security blanket and potentially made them better once that player learned all the blocking schemes and started to gel with their linemates. Given that Kevin Zeitler already played here, with most of these guys, he was probably the best bet.

mamdami is very good for the Republican party. If he gets elected his entire term is going to be a rolling commercial for how much better the Republicans are for the country. We can sit back and watch NY go even farther in the toilet.

Muhammad is 30 years old and has been in the league 9 years. If you meant Hassanein, I completely forgot about him. There’s another one.

Muhammad has played well and Davenport will be back. The DL has been good.

"Great" lineup of endorsers for Cuomo. Wouldn't want Zohran though. He'd be bad for NYC.

Wrong! With Jobe, McGonigle, Anderson, Clark, Olson, Melton, Bicerno, Hamm, Green, Torkelson, Dingler, free agent signings, and whatever prospects we get for Skubal (if he is traded) we will NOT go backwards!!! One more year only for Skubal and a prospect in 2030 is malpractice IMO and is more than likely what we are going to get.

i really hope we dont trade for him.

It will be interesting to see if McGonigle/Harris's picks actually pan out with a higher success rate then Al's. We can check in on this issue again when we know....

Two words: Bill James. The scouting in baseball today is not even comparable to what it was even 10 years ago.... Advanced metrics make scouting more of a science today than ever. Sure there will be misses. But the knowledge on players is on a whole nother planet. Think about going to the moon today versus the 60's when Apollo 11 landed..... They both got there, but how they are done is COMPLETELY different...... (Sorry space week here at UCF). I think a generational trade like this will/could/and should alter the trajectory of the Tigers for the next 15 years......

#1 target -- EDWIN ****ING DIAZ. He had his injury already. Others. - Go after Bregman again, but I still think he never wanted to sign here. But at least kick the tires. Bo Bichette - consistent hitter. If it wasn't for the one bad year he'd be a career .300 hitter. Forget Kyle Schwarber. Power hitters don't want to play at Comerica. I think it's the main reason Bregman didn't want to come here. Sign one of the following Fromber Valdez, Ranger Suarez or Lucas Giolito. It seems like this year there are maybe 12 really good FA and then it drops and drops quickly. If they can get Geyber back at a reasonable price, then do it, but look elsewhere first. If they sign a third baseman they have a lot of different 2b options. But I feel like Scott Harris is the baseball equivalent of Steve Yzerman -- no bold moves. And that makes me think ownership is controlling everything. Do what you can do, just don't spend.

Slightly. We did welcome him to the resistance.

I'll still go with both the best and worst case example being Johann Santana with the Twins, They made the big trade with him coming off 2 Cy Youngs and a year of control. They got the much heralded return of 4 prospects. The prospects all crashed and burned, but MN was 2nd in the div that year and won it outright the two following years without him. If they had kept him they probably win all three years and would been no worse off. That's sort of the limits at both ends in one real case history. Also notable that the Twins dodged a bullet in not giving him a crazy long term deal at 'only' 29, as he only had three more good years and was out of baseball after 4. The Mets ended up paying him for 6 - which actually wasn't terrible compared to terms people are predicting today. Of course that's not the only possible future for Skubal, but it is among the real possibilities a FO has to consider.

He seems to be more in control this season. The tech he got today was justified, stepping in for his teammate.

I am in 100% agreement that he should be traded if you get a front line pitching prospect , another top 15-20 MLB prospect , and a young controllable major leaguer (preferably a pitcher). However, I am expecting Harris to not trade Skubal, us to see the Skubal compensatory pick by 2029 or 2030 and the Tigers trajectory stunted.

I stopped reading after you called it interesting. We call that Hongbits Razor.

His turnovers are fine, it's his efficiency that will determine how good he is/isn't. He currently has a TS% of 50%. For his career he is 53%. Those are awful numbers. You want him up around 60%.

And I would like to add that if we do keep Skubal for 2026 please do not take him out of the game early in the playoffs. If you do what's the point in having him.

Someone said he is probably in town to play in a Billups poker game.

The kicker is that the Feds didn't have much choice but let CP consign the losses to the whole midwest power consortium, so everyone from Iowa to to Ohio is helping carry Trump's water on this one.

LOL ! I was that kid. 👿 😇

I don't even know that extending a catcher after his rookie season would be a good idea, unless he were at least Bill Freehan-level or higher, and we're talking maybe among top twenty in history. And even so, too many bad things can happen to catchers along the way, much more than any other position.

I'd estimate them as approximately equal to the odds the Tigers offer more money than the Mets, Yankees or Red Sox. 🤔

Probably not. Not reason to risk a fluke and getting stuck with a long contract. He’s cheap just take it year by year

I’m such a dope. I keep checking this site and other news sources to see “if anything‘s happened!“ It’s like I’m a kid and even though Thanksgiving itself is weeks away, when my parents are gone I contemplate sneaking around the house trying to find Christmas presents hidden somewhere. I never really did this because I was worried I’d find a box of socks or something and get real sad. I hope Scott and Chris get us more than socks this off-season, and some indication of this occurring sooner rather than later would be welcome.

I was guilty of thinking that Ben Johnson was good but not as special as he was made out to be. A product of being around high end talent and Dan Campbell. I was wrong. Ben is an elite play caller and we miss him.

I mean you can’t ignore the FBI data I just posted and post a gif, but no one expects an honest conversation with you anyway.

Pretty impressive for a rookie

Everyone gets a turn.