ewsieg Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 16 hours ago, casimir said: Along those lines, I noticed a neighbor that flew a Trump flag four years ago has put a Biden flag up this weekend. It's not a real Biden flag unless he's shirtless with bulging muscles, a bandana, and he's holding an assault rifle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 My neighbor put up a Trump flag over his garage.... and he's on the corner so anybody driving down the street, which is a popular shortcut to avoid a light,will see it. So he didn't change his mind. But dammit... he's a nice guy. When it's a snowblower snowfall we both do a bunch of sidewalks together. Once he saw me in my garage getting ready and waved me off, told me to get back inside and have a beer, he's already all dressed up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 1 hour ago, chasfh said: And, also, that they don't violently overthrow the election system altogether and take power by force. That won't happen. he doesn't have the infrastructure to do such a thing. As POTUS, he had a shot since he was in charge of all the government agencies. How he's just some asshole with advisors who are not in power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 Re Trump's Abortion Statement this morning... he probably would have been better off not saying anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 On 4/6/2024 at 1:22 PM, ewsieg said: Point taken, I guess the better way to say it is Is prefer democrats focus their taking points on reproductive rights, democracy, and a party looking for solutions (right or wrong) as I believe those are better topics to control the talking points. If the economy stays there way it is, no independents will be seated to vote for Trump over an economy that is relatively working for them. Yeah, the economic numbers in surveys haven't been good for Biden, but answering a survey and actually going to vote are two different things... Even if it isn't totally reflected in polling or if his polling on the issue lags overall economic sentiment, you would rather have an improving economy regardless because the overall view of the economy, divorced from politics, will ultimately weigh on people's decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 9 minutes ago, oblong said: That won't happen. he doesn't have the infrastructure to do such a thing. As POTUS, he had a shot since he was in charge of all the government agencies. How he's just some asshole with advisors who are not in power. With millions of militant followers armed to the teeth, and prepared for violence, and hanging on every word from TFG, ready to follow his orders, or to follow him into the Capitol ready to overthrow the Constitution of the United States. As they've already demonstrated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 3 minutes ago, mtutiger said: Re Trump's Abortion Statement this morning... he probably would have been better off not saying anything. I can see this two ways: On one hand, a pretty obvious take, and I assume what you are thinking, is that moving away from a hard abortion stance could well hurt him with evangelical voters who are maybe are troubled by the rest of the Trump package but stay with him for the generally hard GOP position on abortion. But OTOH, if this is a part of some broader or coordinated (if anything about Trump is ever coordinated....) effort to move the whole GOP into less extreme water on abortion, maybe he's thinking that could get him the Presidency and a better GOP congressional result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 2 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: With millions of militant followers armed to the teeth, and prepared for violence, and hanging on every word from TFG, ready to follow his orders, or to follow him into the Capitol ready to overthrow the Constitution of the United States. As they've already demonstrated. And Biden isn't going to hesitate to have the National Guard at the ready unlike Trump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 Just now, gehringer_2 said: But OTOH, if this is a part of some broader or coordinated (if anything about Trump is ever coordinated....) effort to move the whole GOP into less extreme water on abortion, maybe he's thinking that could get him the Presidency and a better GOP congressional result. He's trying to frame himself as a moderate on the issue, but the statement included the line that (paraphrasing) he's proud that he was able to take out Roe v. Wade. And all the while not making any actual concrete statements on what he would do if any sort of ban landed on his desk. The only real upside is that the media stenographers will take it at face value... I just don't see it as a piece of brilliant marketing or one that move votes among those who are unhappy with the party on the issue at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 2 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: And Biden isn't going to hesitate to have the National Guard at the ready unlike Trump. That would be my hope. That any further insurrectionists against the United States of America are put down like the rabid dogs that they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 24 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: With millions of militant followers armed to the teeth, and prepared for violence, and hanging on every word from TFG, ready to follow his orders, or to follow him into the Capitol ready to overthrow the Constitution of the United States. As they've already demonstrated. that was a one shot deal. There's hundreds of people in prison right now to deter them from it. We've seen them try **** in the past, like blockades, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.TaterSalad Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 Happy Solar Eclipse day! Remember, don't look directly into the eclipse without the special glasses. It can both damage your retina and make you the moron of the office. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 29 minutes ago, oblong said: that was a one shot deal. There's hundreds of people in prison right now to deter them from it. We've seen them try **** in the past, like blockades, etc. I agree with this. I'm just of a mind to not fall asleep on this because they will try **** again. And they're (the dreaded "they", in which I don't have a specific name. But how about "Trump's Minions' ", who are...) hunting any and every crack in the system to try and take advantage of it and corrupt it or destroy it, if they could. So we don't know exactly what new **** they may try... Just sayin' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 48 minutes ago, oblong said: that was a one shot deal. There's hundreds of people in prison right now to deter them from it. We've seen them try **** in the past, like blockades, etc. The red flags are pretty red right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 8 hours ago, oblong said: That won't happen. he doesn't have the infrastructure to do such a thing. As POTUS, he had a shot since he was in charge of all the government agencies. How he's just some asshole with advisors who are not in power. I also don't think he will be able to successfully violently overthrow the US electoral system, but I can't think of anyone else who could come closer to doing so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 (edited) 8 hours ago, gehringer_2 said: I can see this two ways: On one hand, a pretty obvious take, and I assume what you are thinking, is that moving away from a hard abortion stance could well hurt him with evangelical voters who are maybe are troubled by the rest of the Trump package but stay with him for the generally hard GOP position on abortion. But OTOH, if this is a part of some broader or coordinated (if anything about Trump is ever coordinated....) effort to move the whole GOP into less extreme water on abortion, maybe he's thinking that could get him the Presidency and a better GOP congressional result. It is a clear bid to moderates, especially those in swing districts who are thrilled to have him back the Party off strict abortion bans. Trump is also doing so far enough ahead of the election that it may give them enough time to successfully implement the Oceania strategy, i.e., Trump is against a national abortion ban, Trump has always been against a national abortion ban. It's up to Biden to keep pressure on the issue by continually reminding voters of what Trump did, versus what he says, which is always changing. The wild card is whether Trump threaded the needle well enough in his statements so that Republican moderates and independents can parse the difference between "Trump got Roe overturned to send it back to the states so they can make their individual choices based on local standards", which sounds reasonable on the surface; versus "Trump overturned Roe in advance of banning abortion on a nationwide basis", which makes him look way out of touch with how the majority of people feel about choice. Edited April 8 by chasfh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 I don’t think “giving it back to the states” will help things for the GOP in terms of messaging. That leads to Alabama and Texas and Florida. The Dems can then play up the issue of states monitoring people leaving the state to obtain them. It’s one of those things that sounds reasonable but we have already seen that it’s not practical. It might make moderate congress people happy but voters see thru it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMRivdogs Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 You could possibly add Virginia since Gov FleeceVest vetoed a bill that would protect women from being deported back to their home states for having a legal abortion in Va (if their home state banned it). It also puts doctors at risk as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 (edited) 2 hours ago, oblong said: I don’t think “giving it back to the states” will help things for the GOP in terms of messaging. That leads to Alabama and Texas and Florida. The Dems can then play up the issue of states monitoring people leaving the state to obtain them. It’s one of those things that sounds reasonable but we have already seen that it’s not practical. It might make moderate congress people happy but voters see thru it. Also some of the states that are using their "states rights" to implement policy that is repellent to the moderates that Trump is ostensibly supposed to be assuaging with his statement are considered to be in play (ie. Arizona, Georgia, NC). His message will not work in these places, and likely in the other states that will decide this election. And every moment he and his party spend talking about the issue of abortion is a gift to his / their opponents. Edited April 9 by mtutiger 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 12 hours ago, mtutiger said: Also some of the states that are using their "states rights" to implement policy that is repellent to the moderates that Trump is ostensibly supposed to be assuaging with his statement are considered to be in play (ie. Arizona, Georgia, NC). His message will not work in these places, and likely in the other states that will decide this election. And every moment he and his party spend talking about the issue of abortion is a gift to his / their opponents. I'm sort of a wait-and-see on this one, seeing as how collective amnesia has been shown to be somewhat of a factor among broad swaths of the electorate in the past. I do believe that if Trump put on a good enough show of seeming like he's reoriented to something closer to normal—not a good show, necessarily, but good enough—the moderate Republicans would flock to vote for him, because they desperately want someone anyone seemingly normal that's not a Democrat for vote for. The wild card on that is whether he could keep the hardcore MAGAs after such a reorientation. Seems like a bind to me for him. But it is one potential way for him to win, as unlikely as it seems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 I'm sure Trump can be more moderate with a wink and a nod to the extreme right. They understand better than Democrats how to win elections and don't get bogged down in purity contests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 7 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: I'm sure Trump can be more moderate with a wink and a nod to the extreme right. They understand better than Democrats how to win elections and don't get bogged down in purity contests. Yes, this could happen. It did happen, actually. I believe it was 2016. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 30 minutes ago, chasfh said: I do believe that if Trump put on a good enough show of seeming like he's reoriented to something closer to normal—not a good show, necessarily, but good enough—the moderate Republicans would flock to vote for him, because they desperately want someone anyone seemingly normal that's not a Democrat for vote for. I've been promised way too many "pivots" over the past seven years to just automatically assume one is coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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