2022-23 Detroit Tigers Offseason Thread

[romad1]

13 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said:

ugh. no trades and no signings, but really busy?

when you are in a boat with a myriad of holes, just start by patching one; any one

 

If the goal is to defeat the Japanese Navy in the central pacific, or defeating the Soviet Navy in the North Atlantic, patching holes in your dingy isn't gonna cut it.  

[RatkoVarda]

7 minutes ago, romad1 said:

If the goal is to defeat the Japanese Navy in the central pacific, or defeating the Soviet Navy in the North Atlantic, patching holes in your dingy isn't gonna cut it.  

improving this horrible team should be as easy as falling out of a row boat

[romad1]

4 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said:

improving this horrible team should be as easy as falling out of a row boat

Totally true.  I don't mean to high road.  I want Scott Harris to be some sort of genius with a plan.  When you don't see data points, the lack of datapoints become the datapoints. 

[Tiger337]

1 hour ago, RatkoVarda said:

he could still be average or above average, but if he carries one of the worst bats in MLB again, it won't matter anyway

That is true.  If he is an elite fielder as in 2022, then he would have value just getting back to maybe an 80-85 OPS+.  However, if he's just going to be average defensively, he'll need to get up to a 100 OPS+. 

[casimir]

1 hour ago, Tiger337 said:

Interesting on how much Schoop took advantage of the shift defensively last year:

https://www.motowntigers.com/2022/12/07/ban-on-shifts-could-force-tigers-to-move-jonathan-schoop-off-second/

This kind of jives with what I was wondering about last season.  To my untrained eye, the fielding accolades that were bestowed upon him didn't quite match what I thought was a middle infielder with a poor lack of range.  He did seem to fare well in the shift in shallow RF.  I don't disagree that he's got a pretty strong & accurate arm.

Moving him to 3B seems too simplistic to me.  He hasn't played 3B since his rookie season.  He's got the arm for it, but does he have the instinctual movement for most plays at the hot corner?

If the Tigers can acquire a better 2B than 3B, then sure, try Schoop at 3B.  ideally they can upgrade at both positions and luck into some versatility whereby Schoop is a RHH IF to a LHH OF.  Seems doubtful, but who knows.

[oblong]

Man.... people are impatient.

Signing players is not just a matter of throwing money at them.  You can't put a gun to their head.  You need to offer a reason for another team to give you good players.

Rebuilding isn't just a matter of going to the store and trading 3 players worth 2 points for 1 player worth 8.  You don't go into a general store with a wish list and the guy comes back with your items.  

 

[Dan Gilmore]

Agreed. I think the meetings often just set a preliminary contact/discussion on signing that will be followed up on later (or not). The top FAs get the press, but most will sign later. So I am patient, but also a bit bothered by the high price tags so far.

[casimir]

[KL2]

19 minutes ago, oblong said:

Man.... people are impatient.

Signing players is not just a matter of throwing money at them.  You can't put a gun to their head.  You need to offer a reason for another team to give you good players.

Rebuilding isn't just a matter of going to the store and trading 3 players worth 2 points for 1 player worth 8.  You don't go into a general store with a wish list and the guy comes back with your items.  

 

I think its some of the NFL/NBA bleeding in. People see nearly all teams in those leagues sign guys on day 1. It warps what baseball does when its usually much longer. 

[mtutiger]

17 minutes ago, Dan Gilmore said:

Agreed. I think the meetings often just set a preliminary contact/discussion on signing that will be followed up on later (or not). The top FAs get the press, but most will sign later. So I am patient, but also a bit bothered by the high price tags so far.

Honestly, outside of maybe Jace Peterson, I'm not sure any of the free agents that have fallen thus far were ones that seemed realistic for the Tigers anyway. 

Edited December 7, 2022 by mtutiger

[casimir]

3 minutes ago, KL2 said:

I think its some of the NFL/NBA bleeding in. People see nearly all teams in those leagues sign guys on day 1. It warps what baseball does when its usually much longer. 

That could be part of it.

I think a lot of folks are just simply tired of losing.  And now there's finally a new GM/VP in place, but where are the moves that would be expected with the promise of new leadership?

This team ain't getting turned around in one offseason.  I still think getting the structure of the organization in place is the main function for Harris right now.  Of course he also needs to acquire players in the meantime.  And let's be honest, for most players, its probably about the money over anything else.  But if a player can make a similar amount of money on a winning team, why sign with Detroit?

[1984Echoes]

3 hours ago, Motor City Sonics said:

I just want a RUMOR, even if it's far-fetched.   

I heard a rumor that the Orioles were open to trading their top prospect Gunnar Henderson (3B - LH'ed) for pitching and were talking specifically and exclusively with the Tigers.

[chasfh]

I think a big part of the frustration some folks have might be their need to see something different from the new guy right away, in terms of changing the big league roster, and it not happening as they watch other teams making their moves. Yes, we dumped a lot of guys off the 40 man, we got a lot of waiver churn, and we signed a pitcher who was a devil we know, and those are changes. But, rightly or wrongly, a lot of people frankly expected more than that by now. Patience is a virtue, sure, but on the other hand, fans gonna fan.

I think that if Harris had by now made one signing of a guy who had never been a Tiger, or one trade for a major leaguer people have heard of, we wouldn’t be hearing much whinging about lack of movement. We may continue to hear the whinging until he does make whatever that first big move.

Edited December 7, 2022 by chasfh

[Motor City Sonics]

I heard a rumor.  They say you got a broken heart.  

[Motor City Sonics]

We'll find out one day that the Tigers offered Xander Bogaerts 15 years and 777 million and he still turned them down 

[chasfh]

Per the other thread, Mason Englert was chosen by the Tigers in the Rule V draft.

 

Good news: he has shown that he can control the plate, and he had a sub-1 WHIP in more than 100 innings at A+ last year.

Bad(?) news: He has thrown exactly 15⅓ innings above A+ ball, and like it or not, for better or for worse, he is going to be on the Tigers' 26-man roster all year long. He will get plenty of opportunities to find his footing.

[Tiger337]

Englert has good control the strike zone numbers.  It definitely seems like he'll need more seasoning though.  The 13-pitcher limit makes it difficult to carry a pitcher like him.  

[chasfh]

3 minutes ago, Tiger337 said:

Englert has good control the strike zone numbers.  It definitely seems like he'll need more seasoning though.  The 13-pitcher limit makes it difficult to carry a pitcher like him.  

One thing we don't always remember about Rule 5 picks, because we don't see it a lot: if we don't want to keep him, we can offer him back to his former team for $50,000, and worst case, release him and let him go back on the market and eat the hundred grand.

Edited December 7, 2022 by chasfh

[4hzglory]

Joe is gone.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/12/braves-acquire-joe-jimenez-from-tigers.html

[Tigermojo]

Something happened!

[StatikIEV]

3 hours ago, chasfh said:

Per the other thread, Mason Englert was chosen by the Tigers in the Rule V draft.

 

Good news: he has shown that he can control the plate, and he had a sub-1 WHIP in more than 100 innings at A+ last year.

Bad(?) news: He has thrown exactly 15⅓ innings above A+ ball, and like it or not, for better or for worse, he is going to be on the Tigers' 26-man roster all year long. He will get plenty of opportunities to find his footing.

Never stick.

I know they say you can't have enough pitching...but relative to this guy's skill level, relative prospect status, starting pitcher status and necessity to keep on the roster....we have enough pitching.

I mean where does he fit in our existing and future stable of SPs?  

After Mize, Skubal, Manning, Turnbull, E-Rod, Boyd, Brieske, Jobe, Madden, Flores, Alexander, Faedo, Wentz, Olson, Bergner, Smith, etc. (assuming I misses a couple as I am just haphazardly firing off names).

 

[StatikIEV]

1 minute ago, 4hzglory said:

Joe is gone.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/12/braves-acquire-joe-jimenez-from-tigers.html

...for nothing of immediate (or likely future) value

/nice job

[mtutiger]

The return is Justyn-Henry Malloy and Jake Higginbotham... the former being the centerpiece of the deal.

Pretty good value for Joe on the surface... Malloy looks promising.

[RaceDog]

I think the OF they got back looks very promising...can he go back to 3rd?

[KL2]

10 minutes ago, StatikIEV said:

Never stick.

I know they say you can't have enough pitching...but relative to this guy's skill level, relative prospect status, starting pitcher status and necessity to keep on the roster....we have enough pitching.

I mean where does he fit in our existing and future stable of SPs?  

After Mize, Skubal, Manning, Turnbull, E-Rod, Boyd, Brieske, Jobe, Madden, Flores, Alexander, Faedo, Wentz, Olson, Bergner, Smith, etc. (assuming I misses a couple as I am just haphazardly firing off names).

 

He goes to mop up duty for a year if he makes it, then you can stick him in triple a and use him for depth