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2022-23 Detroit Tigers Offseason Thread


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2 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

I'll grant I tend to be in this camp. As I think about it, part it may be that AJ talks ups his bad players a lot, and maybe that is pure psychological tactic and doesn't reflect his true evaluation of those players.  If that is true, and I can only hope it is - it certainly may be, then I think it validates this view.

I do think it's possible to criticize AJ's overeliance on certain players while not disliking AJ or wanting him fired. 

For me, I've been less critical of him since the firing of Al in part because they (finally) called Kerry Carpenter up on the same day... it may be coincidental, but they got more creative transaction-wise once Avila was gone and it was Menzin/AJ handling things, suggesting that some criticism lodged earlier on may have applied more to Avila than AJ.

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1 hour ago, RatkoVarda said:

Except for Lange, whole post might  be correct.

Lange is to me penciled in as 2023 closer. Unless they trade him, he will be one of the most important BP pieces, if not the most important

I agree about keeping Lange, and you can pencil him in as a closer, but Joe J deserves a real shot at it after this season. 

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3 hours ago, 1984Echoes said:

So, based on some of the comments above: I would construct our off-season 40-man under the following Title: Pre-Trade/FA 40, with the following parameters: Rule 5 guys that you want protected, list the full 40 because any subsequent moves (dropped in favor of a FA, dropped in favor of a pending Rule 5 selection, or any trades)… are an unknown at this point. The following 40 is simply my guess at our starting point before any other offseason moves are made (if you want to propose trading Soto or any similar move, have at it… this is just my “starting point”):

 

Pitchers:

Tyler Alexander (29L 1.30), Beau Brieske (25R 1.06), Luis Castillo (27R 1.30), Andrew Chafin (33L 1.22), Angel De Jesus (26R 1.13), Alex Faedo (27R 1.11), Jason Foley (27R 1.34), Rony García (25R 1.16), Sawyer Gipson-Long (4.7 - 25R AA 1.26), Garrett Hill (27R 1.20), Joe Jiménez (28R 1.34), Matt Manning, Casey Mize, Eduardo Rodriguez, Elvin Rodriguez (25R 1.23), Tarik Skubal, Gregory Soto (28L 1.35), Spencer Turnbull, Will Vest (27R 1.30), Joey Wentz, Brendan White (3.8 - 24R AA 1.20)

 

Bubble/ Gone:

José Cisnero (34R 1.34), Miguel Diaz (28R 1.33), Kyle Funkhouser (29R 1.43), Bryan Garcia (28R 1.20), Drew Hutchison (32R 1.42), Alex Lange (27R 1.33), Daniel Norris (30L 1.38)

 

Going out on a limb here: and protecting Gipson-Long and Brendan White. Just a hunch (that and their high K-BB ratios if we’re doing analytics).

IMO – all of these guys that we’ve “lost” here… can be invited back on Spring Training invites. I think all of them will be back as such, along with whatever other competition Harris can find/ sign as a FA/ or trade for. The last two of which obviously would engender even more 40 man transactions.

 

 

Position Players:

Akil Baddoo, Javier Báez, Daz Cameron, Jeimer Candelario, Kerry Carpenter, Harold Castro, Brendon Davis, Riley Greene, Eric Haase, Ryan Kreidler, Andre Lipcius, Austin Meadows, Parker Meadows, Wenceel Perez, Victor Reyes, Jake Rogers, Ali Sánchez, Jonathan Schoop, Spencer Torkelson

 

Leaving/ retired:

Tucker Barnhart, Miguel Cabrera, Willi Castro, Kody Clemens, Luis García, Josh Lester, Zack Short

 

Sorry… My agenda is to “retire” Miggy. Feel free to add him back in in your versions of our 40 and drop whatever borderline pitcher/ Rule 5/ bench guy that you want to. My last struggle was between Willi, Adinso Reyes, and Daz… I don’t really consider Willi an OF’er, really he’s a guy with no glove/ position so… I’m giving Daz just one more chance (and taking a chance in losing Adinso). I don’t feel good about it. But that’s the way it goes until we sign someone better and Daz loses his 40 spot… TBC…

Dumping Lange but keeping Cameron?  Wowza.

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10 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

If you're going to designate him as your long reliever/emergency starter, maybe, but Hinch's love affair with him as starter does have to end.

I think Alexander started more games out of necessity as opposed to anything else.   Heck, Bryan Garcia started 4 games after he was DFAd as a reliever.  Hutchison ended up with 28 games started, easily leading the ball club.

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2 hours ago, RatkoVarda said:

Except for Lange, whole post might  be correct.

Lange is to me penciled in as 2023 closer. Unless they trade him, he will be one of the most important BP pieces, if not the most important

Yes—why in the world would we let Lange leave?  Probably our best bullpen piece.

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6 hours ago, HeyAbbott said:

 

 

I have grown tired with the 20 plus years of pissing and moaning about the dimensions of the park. Put in a new wall that makes the longest distance at 405 feet. Pull in RF by 15 feet.

 

I hope they move the fences back 15 feet just to yank chains.

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Just now, casimir said:

I think Alexander started more games out of necessity as opposed to anything else.   Heck, Bryan Garcia started 4 games after he was DFAd as a reliever.  Hutchison ended up with 28 games started, easily leading the ball club.

I know there isn't much love for B. Garcia, but his pitches have big time movement. I think he has more MLB potential that he gets credit for.

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1 hour ago, gehringer_2 said:

Daz has been dead man walking in terms of MLB. Though like C. Stewart, Daz is not a bad fit for a career AAA profile.

Yeah the ship has definitely sailed for Daz and unfortunately for him he doesn't have that one great skill that a team my gravitate at to give him a shot if they are in a pinch. Perhaps some other org can unlock something in him but personally I put those odds at slim to none. 

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1 hour ago, casimir said:

He’s thrown only 90 MLB innings, but he also owns a BB9 starting with a 5.

Verlander's K rate after 180 IP was 6.0. Not to compare the two in any sense but just to point out that pitchers can learn how to get more K's with experience. I'm not predicting that for B. Garcia, but he is a guy I'd like to see him get more run somewhere because there are hints of potential upside - and as a starter he really doesn't even have anything like 90 IP yet.

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2 hours ago, casimir said:

Dumping Lange but keeping Cameron?  Wowza.

Yeah OK... probably my weakest move...

I think I dinged Lange on weak K-BB ratio, weak WHIP #'s, but was concentrating on minor league numbers for all the young guys with small sample sizes and may have misfired on Lange.

But a quick perusal...

Go ahead and put Lange back on the 40... but I'm thinking of sacrificing Schoop rather than Daz. That may be symphonic dissonance to everyone's ears... and it's not like I'm all that high on Daz... more like I am very, very down on Schoop. As far as I'm concerned, out with over-the-hill and hold onto the kids, just in case.

Just my 2 cents...

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2 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

I know there isn't much love for B. Garcia, but his pitches have big time movement. I think he has more MLB potential that he gets credit for.

I think he will get Spring Training invite love this year... and I'd be OK with that being the Tigers STI...

And not much more than that. Minor league contract at best, just a guess.

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10 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

Verlander's K rate after 180 IP was 6.0. Not to compare the two in any sense but just to point out that pitchers can learn how to get more K's with experience. I'm not predicting that for B. Garcia, but he is a guy I'd like to see him get more run somewhere because there are hints of potential upside - and as a starter he really doesn't even have anything like 90 IP yet.

Garcia is a guy that I'm surprised they had success in stretching out into a starter (very limited) because he seemed to me to be the epitome of a solo inning RP.  I still don't have much faith in him going forward because of his meek SO9.  That number completely fell off of the table once he was promoted above AA.  Maybe its simply a function of his AA & under SO9 being inflated due to small sample size, I don't know.

image.thumb.png.553a22a26a0cc495a458f54bce9ad638.png

I guess given the number of pitchers that are questionable for protecting vs not protecting on the 40, I would give great emphasis on those that can control the strike zone like the new boss said and hedge to those that can deliver multiple innings per appearance.  The former is a filter with the latter being a tiebreaker, so to speak.

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10 hours ago, 1984Echoes said:

Yeah OK... probably my weakest move...

I think I dinged Lange on weak K-BB ratio, weak WHIP #'s, but was concentrating on minor league numbers for all the young guys with small sample sizes and may have misfired on Lange.

But a quick perusal...

Go ahead and put Lange back on the 40... but I'm thinking of sacrificing Schoop rather than Daz. That may be symphonic dissonance to everyone's ears... and it's not like I'm all that high on Daz... more like I am very, very down on Schoop. As far as I'm concerned, out with over-the-hill and hold onto the kids, just in case.

Just my 2 cents...

Its OK to move on from both Schoop and Cameron.  This team needs more offense than they can provide.

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8 minutes ago, casimir said:

I guess given the number of pitchers that are questionable for protecting vs not protecting on the 40, I would give great emphasis on those that can control the strike zone like the new boss said and hedge to those that can deliver multiple innings per appearance.  The former is a filter with the latter being a tiebreaker, so to speak.

we'll see if they are committed enough to this to say goodbye to both Cisnero and Soto.

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13 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

Best news since the Avila firing!

I can't remember if Paul was brought in before Hinch or not.

It'll be interesting to see if Lombard does indeed move on to a manager's role elsewhere and if Hinch moves upstairs (which could mean a promotion with no moving vans for Lombard).

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I would think if Hinch moves into the front office, it would happen sooner than later.

I agree that I doubt Hinch moves upstairs solely to keep Lombard.  But, hey, we were told that they're going to to willing to take risks.  Not sure this move would be a risk, but it certainly would seem to classify as unorthodox.

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