2023 NFL Draft Thread

[MichiganCardinal]

7 minutes ago, Shinzaki said:

I weigh 310 lbs at 6-5"

Can you play DT? Asking for a friend.

[Shinzaki]

Just now, MichiganCardinal said:

Can you play DT? Asking for a friend.

I'm 62 years old and I have surgical metal in both arms so...Hell Yes

[MichiganCardinal]

6 hours ago, Longgone said:

Anderson is not that caliber, need or fit. This draft is noteworthy for it's depth, but it's not very strong at the top. If he falls great, but otherwise there are too many holes and too many players with similar rankings.

I think I respectfully disagree RE Anderson.

If you eliminate QBs from the discussion, I see a large gap between Anderson's ceiling and the next best player in this draft (probably Bijan or Tyree Wilson). People seem to have forgotten just how dominant Anderson was in 2021... 101 tackles, 31.5 TFL, and 17.5 sacks, largely while being doubled in the SEC West. If he had repeated that in 2022, he would have been the undisputed #1 overall prospect. There has almost been a staring effect on him, where he has been considered a top draft prospect for so long that so-called experts manufacture flaws. Carter's ceiling is closer to Anderson than either Bijan or Wilson, but I think his floor is so low (as well as the problems discussed ad nauseam) that will be removed from the board altogether.

As for the Lions, I do think they would seriously benefit by having an elite edge rusher across from Hutch. Hutch was the most double teamed edge in all of football last year. I loved Houston's production as much as the next guy, but I don't think you let a 6th round rookie who flash-bangs onto the scene for five or six games stop you from taking an elite presence. There are even some 3rd down formations where you can justify putting all three of Hutch, Anderson, and Houston on the field at the same time and letting one of them (probably Hutch) send a delayed bullrush from the inside. If you've got the talent they'll find their way onto the field. I think a Hutch/Anderson combo would be take over some amount of games though.

I don't want to sit at #6 and "settle" for a second tier talent, when getting a top tier talent is within reach. I don't think Holmes will either, if he sees the board that way.

Edited March 15, 2023 by MichiganCardinal

[Longgone]

22 minutes ago, MichiganCardinal said:

I think I respectfully disagree RE Anderson.

If you eliminate QBs from the discussion, I see a large gap between Anderson's ceiling and the next best player in this draft (probably Bijan or Tyree Wilson). People seem to have forgotten just how dominant Anderson was in 2021... 101 tackles, 31.5 TFL, and 17.5 sacks, largely while being doubled in the SEC West. If he had repeated that in 2022, he would have been the undisputed #1 overall prospect. There has almost been a staring effect on him, where he has been considered a top draft prospect for so long that so-called experts manufacture flaws. Carter's ceiling is closer to Anderson than either Bijan or Wilson, but I think his floor is so low (as well as the problems discussed ad nauseam) that will be removed from the board altogether.

As for the Lions, I do think they would seriously benefit by having an elite edge rusher across from Hutch. Hutch was the most double teamed edge in all of football last year. I loved Houston's production as much as the next guy, but I don't think you let a 6th round rookie who flash-bangs onto the scene for five or six games stop you from taking an elite presence. There are even some 3rd down formations where you can justify putting all three of Hutch, Anderson, and Houston on the field at the same time and letting one of them (probably Hutch) send a delayed bullrush from the inside. If you've got the talent they'll find their way onto the field. I think a Hutch/Anderson combo would be take over some amount of games though.

I don't want to sit at #6 and "settle" for a second tier talent, when getting a top tier talent is within reach. I don't think Holmes will either, if he sees the board that way.

You're basing this too much on what draft pundits say. Anderson is very advanced and instinctual, and he's a good athlete, but far from a physical freak. There will be teams, based on their schemes and system, who have other defensive players graded higher. He's a good prospect, just not the generational type you sell out for.

[Motown Bombers]

Struggled to even complete the drills he did attempt. I'm not even sure he is a 1st rounder anymore. 

 

[MichiganCardinal]

10 minutes ago, Longgone said:

You're basing this too much on what draft pundits say. Anderson is very advanced and instinctual, and he's a good athlete, but far from a physical freak. There will be teams, based on their schemes and system, who have other defensive players graded higher. He's a good prospect, just not the generational type you sell out for.

I actually think I may be higher on him than most pundits.

I think you’re correct in our differences of him though. I do see a possible generational talent, especially from his 21 tape, and I know the consensus is that he is not. In the same way Travon Walker rose and Hutchinson fell when analytics got involved, I think that’s what we are seeing with Anderson falling and Wilson rising, despite Anderson, like Hutch, being really the best player on the board. Analytics are useful, but I don’t think the numbers should blind someone from raw production. Some guys are just beasts that get the job done.

[Jason_R]

Anderson is small. Just 235 lbs. Detroit doesn’t have anyone on the DL that small. I guess size hasn’t been an issue  for Micah Parsons who is listed at 245. But that’s my concern about Anderson… who almost certainly won’t drop to 6 anyway. 

[buddha]

i'll take the next micha parsons, thanks.

btw, parsons had a whole bunch of pre-draft "character concerns" and turned out to be a pretty good draft pick.

[1984Echoes]

44 minutes ago, MichiganCardinal said:

I actually think I may be higher on him than most pundits.

I think you’re correct in our differences of him though. I do see a possible generational talent, especially from his 21 tape, and I know the consensus is that he is not. In the same way Travon Walker rose and Hutchinson fell when analytics got involved, I think that’s what we are seeing with Anderson falling and Wilson rising, despite Anderson, like Hutch, being really the best player on the board. Analytics are useful, but I don’t think the numbers should blind someone from raw production. Some guys are just beasts that get the job done.

Can he cover TE's? Or RB's out in the flat or on screens?

Asking for a friend...

[Motown Bombers]

Micah Parsons didn't gain a bunch of weight, refuse to run a 40, struggle to complete basic positional drills,, or was involved in an event that got people killed. 

[buddha]

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/fo100

Anderson is the complete package as an edge rusher. He's so explosive in his first three steps that he can almost intercept the snap if left unblocked. His lateral quickness is outstanding. His pass-rushing moves are economical and effective: he can disengage from pass-protectors with a quick swipe of his arm and a step to his left.

Anderson's awareness and play-recognition skills supplement his pass-rushing ability well. He'll step back and leap for a deflection when he anticipates a short pass (three batted/deflected passes in 2021). He reads screens and disrupts misdirection plays. Anderson weaves through traffic fluidly on stunts and knows his role when eating up blockers for a teammate.

 

As for run defense, well, Anderson played at around 245 pounds, and bigger/better blockers can latch on and move Anderson when the play is coming right at him.

If Anderson were about 10 pounds of meaningful playing weight stouter, he might be the best edge-rush prospect from ANY program of this century. At the risk of dooming a prospect with a Hall of Fame comparison: Anderson has Von Miller-like measurables and film. He's that athletic, explosive, and unique. He'll likely enter the NFL as a prohibitive Defensive Rookie of the Year favorite, and he should have double-digit sack impact right away.

[buddha]

4 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Micah Parsons didn't gain a bunch of weight, refuse to run a 40, struggle to complete basic positional drills,, or was involved in an event that got people killed. 

will anderson did all of that?  you'd think that would have made the papers.

[Motown Bombers]

2 minutes ago, buddha said:

will anderson did all of that?  you'd think that would have made the papers.

Weird, never said Will Anderson. 

[Longgone]

11 minutes ago, buddha said:

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/fo100

Anderson is the complete package as an edge rusher. He's so explosive in his first three steps that he can almost intercept the snap if left unblocked. His lateral quickness is outstanding. His pass-rushing moves are economical and effective: he can disengage from pass-protectors with a quick swipe of his arm and a step to his left.

Anderson's awareness and play-recognition skills supplement his pass-rushing ability well. He'll step back and leap for a deflection when he anticipates a short pass (three batted/deflected passes in 2021). He reads screens and disrupts misdirection plays. Anderson weaves through traffic fluidly on stunts and knows his role when eating up blockers for a teammate.

 

As for run defense, well, Anderson played at around 245 pounds, and bigger/better blockers can latch on and move Anderson when the play is coming right at him.

If Anderson were about 10 pounds of meaningful playing weight stouter, he might be the best edge-rush prospect from ANY program of this century. At the risk of dooming a prospect with a Hall of Fame comparison: Anderson has Von Miller-like measurables and film. He's that athletic, explosive, and unique. He'll likely enter the NFL as a prohibitive Defensive Rookie of the Year favorite, and he should have double-digit sack impact right away.

From Charlie Campbell:

"However in speaking to a number of team sources during the fall of 2022, they said they did not see a freak athlete or generational talent with Anderson. They saw a good football player, but not a player with a special skill set like other high first-round pass rushers like Garrett, Chase Young, Clowney, or the Bosa brothers.

"I love Will Anderson but have some question as to how well his dominance will translate to the NFL," said an AFC director of player personnel. "What is his dominant trait other than instincts? Size? No. Speed? No. Strength/power? No. He's not special athletically, so are these sack numbers inflated?"

[NYLion]

25 minutes ago, buddha said:

i'll take the next micha parsons, thanks.

btw, parsons had a whole bunch of pre-draft "character concerns" and turned out to be a pretty good draft pick.

His perceived character concerns were way different than Carter's, not nearly as serious off the field and he had no work ethic/laziness issues whatsoever.

With that said, I'd still consider Carter at 6 because he has the highest upside of any player in this draft including QBs but there's real risk and I highly doubt it's a risk that Dan and Brad are interested in taking on. "No Turds Allowed", these guys live by that phrase.

Edited March 15, 2023 by NYLion

[MichiganCardinal]

31 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

Anderson is small. Just 235 lbs. Detroit doesn’t have anyone on the DL that small. I guess size hasn’t been an issue  for Micah Parsons who is listed at 245. But that’s my concern about Anderson… who almost certainly won’t drop to 6 anyway. 

Anderson came in at 6’ 3 1/2” / 253 lbs. at the combine, which was +10 lbs. from his listed weight at Alabama. Even assuming he downed a couple gallons of water before stepping on the scale, I’m not too worried about his size.

[MichiganCardinal]

22 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said:

Can he cover TE's? Or RB's out in the flat or on screens?

Asking for a friend...

Is your friend Alex Anzalone? Don’t worry, his job is secure.

I will say though that if they do go the route of a pure edge rusher like Anderson, the linebackers will be tested. Less time in the pocket means more quick slants and screens.

[MichiganCardinal]

18 minutes ago, buddha said:

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/fo100

Anderson is the complete package as an edge rusher. He's so explosive in his first three steps that he can almost intercept the snap if left unblocked. His lateral quickness is outstanding. His pass-rushing moves are economical and effective: he can disengage from pass-protectors with a quick swipe of his arm and a step to his left.

Anderson's awareness and play-recognition skills supplement his pass-rushing ability well. He'll step back and leap for a deflection when he anticipates a short pass (three batted/deflected passes in 2021). He reads screens and disrupts misdirection plays. Anderson weaves through traffic fluidly on stunts and knows his role when eating up blockers for a teammate.

 

As for run defense, well, Anderson played at around 245 pounds, and bigger/better blockers can latch on and move Anderson when the play is coming right at him.

If Anderson were about 10 pounds of meaningful playing weight stouter, he might be the best edge-rush prospect from ANY program of this century. At the risk of dooming a prospect with a Hall of Fame comparison: Anderson has Von Miller-like measurables and film. He's that athletic, explosive, and unique. He'll likely enter the NFL as a prohibitive Defensive Rookie of the Year favorite, and he should have double-digit sack impact right away.

 

5 minutes ago, Longgone said:

From Charlie Campbell:

"However in speaking to a number of team sources during the fall of 2022, they said they did not see a freak athlete or generational talent with Anderson. They saw a good football player, but not a player with a special skill set like other high first-round pass rushers like Garrett, Chase Young, Clowney, or the Bosa brothers.

"I love Will Anderson but have some question as to how well his dominance will translate to the NFL," said an AFC director of player personnel. "What is his dominant trait other than instincts? Size? No. Speed? No. Strength/power? No. He's not special athletically, so are these sack numbers inflated?"

This discrepancy is what I was referring to earlier. It feels like those who scout based off of film are head over heels about the guy, while those who love their numbers, measurements, and analytics are more hesitant.

For me, I think the tail end of that quote Campbell got from an AFC exec is a bit laughable. “Are these sack numbers inflated?” He put up 37.5 sacks in 39 games in the SEC West. Was that too many for you? I think the numbers guys can get so far wrapped up in what their numbers say a player should be rather than what their eyes tell us they are. Some guys - especially the elite ones - can just defy your numbers and flat out ball.

[Motown Bombers]

 

[buddha]

i think carter is intentionally tanking his draft stock so the lions can take him at 18.

[buddha]

31 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Weird, never said Will Anderson. 

weird how the comparison was between micah parsons and will anderson in the posts right above where you made your snarky comment.

do you want to go back and look and continue this stupid ass pissing match even further?

[Motown Bombers]

I would be shocked at this point if the Lions drafted Carter in any round. 

[Jason_R]

22 minutes ago, Longgone said:

From Charlie Campbell:

"However in speaking to a number of team sources during the fall of 2022, they said they did not see a freak athlete or generational talent with Anderson. They saw a good football player, but not a player with a special skill set like other high first-round pass rushers like Garrett, Chase Young, Clowney, or the Bosa brothers.

"I love Will Anderson but have some question as to how well his dominance will translate to the NFL," said an AFC director of player personnel. "What is his dominant trait other than instincts? Size? No. Speed? No. Strength/power? No. He's not special athletically, so are these sack numbers inflated?"

Yes, this has stuck in my mind about Anderson. People say a lot of things about prospects. By definition you don’t have a generational prospect every draft. 

I like that he’s bulked up. But it still seems moot, especially since Carter is sinking like a stone. 

[Jason_R]

Just listening to Pat Kirwan. He says he thinks Bijan will be off the board before pick 9. 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Motown Bombers]

Just now, buddha said:

weird how the comparison was between micah parsons and will anderson in the posts right above where you made your snarky comment.

do you want to go back and look and continue this stupid ass pissing match even further?

Weird how no one mentioned character issues with Anderson and you still brought up character issues. The only player character issues were being discussed was Carter. On top of that, I didn't even quote you. Someone else quoted you and brought up Carter and yet you didn't respond to them. You responded only to me and then complain about a pissing match. You can go piss off.